Chances that TL kicks koosta and begs s1mple to come back to NA? Should probably kick nitro too if he had such a problem with a player 10x his skill level.
Having a round robin stage is pretty pointless. No one is going to give 2 shits where they place since they have to verse the same teams in the group playoffs anyway.
On May 25 2016 11:15 foxmeep wrote: Having a round robin stage is pretty pointless. No one is going to give 2 shits where they place since they have to verse the same teams in the group playoffs anyway.
I'm sure renegades, liquid and c9 for sure don't want to play against LG in the first playoff match
That Koosta molly round throw is dumbfounding but I cant look away. Where is the poster or posters who constantly say dumb things like "S1mple's dumb plays lose TL rounds"? I feel like you could plug hiko into almost any NA team and that team will perform better than liquid. Elige never played so good as when s1mple was on this roster. Nitro is just nothing special at this point and has probably already peaked. Adren is a known quantity, koosta is a disappointment. TL management should have just told these guys to stfu and deal with a 'toxic' player because that toxic player actually performs on lan and has fans. If they didn't like it they should have been kicked. Legit can't get over how disappointed I am by TL's mismanagement after looking so promising for a month or two this year.
Edit: If you count liquid's day yesterday as a lan, they have only beaten selfless and cloud 9 on lan over the last 4 lans.
On May 25 2016 22:58 HugoBallzak wrote: That Koosta molly round throw is dumbfounding but I cant look away. Where is the poster or posters who constantly say dumb things like "S1mple's dumb plays lose TL rounds"? I feel like you could plug hiko into almost any NA team and that team will perform better than liquid. Elige never played so good as when s1mple was on this roster. Nitro is just nothing special at this point and has probably already peaked. Adren is a known quantity, koosta is a disappointment. TL management should have just told these guys to stfu and deal with a 'toxic' player because that toxic player actually performs on lan and has fans. If they didn't like it they should have been kicked. Legit can't get over how disappointed I am by TL's mismanagement after looking so promising for a month or two this year.
Edit: If you count liquid's day yesterday as a lan, they have only beaten selfless and cloud 9 on lan over the last 4 lans.
But HugoBallzak, it's not about winning, it's about participating and having fun, don't ever let anybody convince you otherwise. They say it's "competitive" Counter-Strike. I think it's no different from my 5 year old little cousin's soccer league. It's about enjoying one's self, and who knows if we're lucky maybe we stumble on 1.2 million dollars more or less by mistake. Now let's go watch 12 hours of Bob Ross.
On May 25 2016 22:58 HugoBallzak wrote: That Koosta molly round throw is dumbfounding but I cant look away. Where is the poster or posters who constantly say dumb things like "S1mple's dumb plays lose TL rounds"? I feel like you could plug hiko into almost any NA team and that team will perform better than liquid. Elige never played so good as when s1mple was on this roster. Nitro is just nothing special at this point and has probably already peaked. Adren is a known quantity, koosta is a disappointment. TL management should have just told these guys to stfu and deal with a 'toxic' player because that toxic player actually performs on lan and has fans. If they didn't like it they should have been kicked. Legit can't get over how disappointed I am by TL's mismanagement after looking so promising for a month or two this year.
Edit: If you count liquid's day yesterday as a lan, they have only beaten selfless and cloud 9 on lan over the last 4 lans.
But HugoBallzak, it's not about winning, it's about participating and having fun, don't ever let anybody convince you otherwise. They say it's "competitive" Counter-Strike. I think it's no different from my 5 year old little cousin's soccer league. It's about enjoying one's self, and who knows if we're lucky maybe we stumble on 1.2 million dollars more or less by mistake. Now let's go watch 12 hours of Bob Ross.
There's a good balance between being cancerous and competitive. Oh well, hard to argue with hardcore simple fanboys :>
On May 25 2016 22:58 HugoBallzak wrote: That Koosta molly round throw is dumbfounding but I cant look away. Where is the poster or posters who constantly say dumb things like "S1mple's dumb plays lose TL rounds"? I feel like you could plug hiko into almost any NA team and that team will perform better than liquid. Elige never played so good as when s1mple was on this roster. Nitro is just nothing special at this point and has probably already peaked. Adren is a known quantity, koosta is a disappointment. TL management should have just told these guys to stfu and deal with a 'toxic' player because that toxic player actually performs on lan and has fans. If they didn't like it they should have been kicked. Legit can't get over how disappointed I am by TL's mismanagement after looking so promising for a month or two this year.
Edit: If you count liquid's day yesterday as a lan, they have only beaten selfless and cloud 9 on lan over the last 4 lans.
But HugoBallzak, it's not about winning, it's about participating and having fun, don't ever let anybody convince you otherwise. They say it's "competitive" Counter-Strike. I think it's no different from my 5 year old little cousin's soccer league. It's about enjoying one's self, and who knows if we're lucky maybe we stumble on 1.2 million dollars more or less by mistake. Now let's go watch 12 hours of Bob Ross.
There's a good balance between being cancerous and competitive. Oh well, hard to argue with hardcore simple fanboys :>
You mean its hard to argue because liquid is literally terrible since s1mple left?
On May 25 2016 22:58 HugoBallzak wrote: That Koosta molly round throw is dumbfounding but I cant look away. Where is the poster or posters who constantly say dumb things like "S1mple's dumb plays lose TL rounds"? I feel like you could plug hiko into almost any NA team and that team will perform better than liquid. Elige never played so good as when s1mple was on this roster. Nitro is just nothing special at this point and has probably already peaked. Adren is a known quantity, koosta is a disappointment. TL management should have just told these guys to stfu and deal with a 'toxic' player because that toxic player actually performs on lan and has fans. If they didn't like it they should have been kicked. Legit can't get over how disappointed I am by TL's mismanagement after looking so promising for a month or two this year.
Edit: If you count liquid's day yesterday as a lan, they have only beaten selfless and cloud 9 on lan over the last 4 lans.
But HugoBallzak, it's not about winning, it's about participating and having fun, don't ever let anybody convince you otherwise. They say it's "competitive" Counter-Strike. I think it's no different from my 5 year old little cousin's soccer league. It's about enjoying one's self, and who knows if we're lucky maybe we stumble on 1.2 million dollars more or less by mistake. Now let's go watch 12 hours of Bob Ross.
There's a good balance between being cancerous and competitive. Oh well, hard to argue with hardcore simple fanboys :>
You mean its hard to argue because liquid is literally terrible since s1mple left?
Yes i do agree that Liquid is worse atm than with S1mple. Im still not sold on the "terrible decision" part tho. if Simple wasnt kicked the team wouldve been torn down by him anyways.
On May 25 2016 22:58 HugoBallzak wrote: That Koosta molly round throw is dumbfounding but I cant look away. Where is the poster or posters who constantly say dumb things like "S1mple's dumb plays lose TL rounds"? I feel like you could plug hiko into almost any NA team and that team will perform better than liquid. Elige never played so good as when s1mple was on this roster. Nitro is just nothing special at this point and has probably already peaked. Adren is a known quantity, koosta is a disappointment. TL management should have just told these guys to stfu and deal with a 'toxic' player because that toxic player actually performs on lan and has fans. If they didn't like it they should have been kicked. Legit can't get over how disappointed I am by TL's mismanagement after looking so promising for a month or two this year.
Edit: If you count liquid's day yesterday as a lan, they have only beaten selfless and cloud 9 on lan over the last 4 lans.
But HugoBallzak, it's not about winning, it's about participating and having fun, don't ever let anybody convince you otherwise. They say it's "competitive" Counter-Strike. I think it's no different from my 5 year old little cousin's soccer league. It's about enjoying one's self, and who knows if we're lucky maybe we stumble on 1.2 million dollars more or less by mistake. Now let's go watch 12 hours of Bob Ross.
There's a good balance between being cancerous and competitive. Oh well, hard to argue with hardcore simple fanboys :>
You mean its hard to argue because liquid is literally terrible since s1mple left?
Yes i do agree that Liquid is worse atm than with S1mple. Im still not sold on the "terrible decision" part tho. if Simple wasnt kicked the team wouldve been torn down by him anyways.
On May 25 2016 22:58 HugoBallzak wrote: That Koosta molly round throw is dumbfounding but I cant look away. Where is the poster or posters who constantly say dumb things like "S1mple's dumb plays lose TL rounds"? I feel like you could plug hiko into almost any NA team and that team will perform better than liquid. Elige never played so good as when s1mple was on this roster. Nitro is just nothing special at this point and has probably already peaked. Adren is a known quantity, koosta is a disappointment. TL management should have just told these guys to stfu and deal with a 'toxic' player because that toxic player actually performs on lan and has fans. If they didn't like it they should have been kicked. Legit can't get over how disappointed I am by TL's mismanagement after looking so promising for a month or two this year.
Edit: If you count liquid's day yesterday as a lan, they have only beaten selfless and cloud 9 on lan over the last 4 lans.
But HugoBallzak, it's not about winning, it's about participating and having fun, don't ever let anybody convince you otherwise. They say it's "competitive" Counter-Strike. I think it's no different from my 5 year old little cousin's soccer league. It's about enjoying one's self, and who knows if we're lucky maybe we stumble on 1.2 million dollars more or less by mistake. Now let's go watch 12 hours of Bob Ross.
There's a good balance between being cancerous and competitive. Oh well, hard to argue with hardcore simple fanboys :>
You mean its hard to argue because liquid is literally terrible since s1mple left?
Yes i do agree that Liquid is worse atm than with S1mple. Im still not sold on the "terrible decision" part tho. if Simple wasnt kicked the team wouldve been torn down by him anyways.
You mean carried by him?
If you can't even practice because hes so toxic, how do you expect a team to stay together
On May 26 2016 02:17 ptbl wrote: Does anyone think that Liquid is playing worse under their new coach peacemaker? Maybe he should stop IGL and give it back to the players.
On May 25 2016 22:58 HugoBallzak wrote: That Koosta molly round throw is dumbfounding but I cant look away. Where is the poster or posters who constantly say dumb things like "S1mple's dumb plays lose TL rounds"? I feel like you could plug hiko into almost any NA team and that team will perform better than liquid. Elige never played so good as when s1mple was on this roster. Nitro is just nothing special at this point and has probably already peaked. Adren is a known quantity, koosta is a disappointment. TL management should have just told these guys to stfu and deal with a 'toxic' player because that toxic player actually performs on lan and has fans. If they didn't like it they should have been kicked. Legit can't get over how disappointed I am by TL's mismanagement after looking so promising for a month or two this year.
Edit: If you count liquid's day yesterday as a lan, they have only beaten selfless and cloud 9 on lan over the last 4 lans.
But HugoBallzak, it's not about winning, it's about participating and having fun, don't ever let anybody convince you otherwise. They say it's "competitive" Counter-Strike. I think it's no different from my 5 year old little cousin's soccer league. It's about enjoying one's self, and who knows if we're lucky maybe we stumble on 1.2 million dollars more or less by mistake. Now let's go watch 12 hours of Bob Ross.
There's a good balance between being cancerous and competitive. Oh well, hard to argue with hardcore simple fanboys :>
I don't think I'm a s1mple "fanboy", I don't follow him, I only cared because he was on TL. Now that he's not, I really don't care about him or what he does.
It's funny though, you say there's a good balance between cancerous and competitive. Imagine for a moment that we learned that Messi's cancer made him vastly more competitive... Then we'd have to conclude that he was balancing his cancer pretty well.
On May 25 2016 22:58 HugoBallzak wrote: That Koosta molly round throw is dumbfounding but I cant look away. Where is the poster or posters who constantly say dumb things like "S1mple's dumb plays lose TL rounds"? I feel like you could plug hiko into almost any NA team and that team will perform better than liquid. Elige never played so good as when s1mple was on this roster. Nitro is just nothing special at this point and has probably already peaked. Adren is a known quantity, koosta is a disappointment. TL management should have just told these guys to stfu and deal with a 'toxic' player because that toxic player actually performs on lan and has fans. If they didn't like it they should have been kicked. Legit can't get over how disappointed I am by TL's mismanagement after looking so promising for a month or two this year.
Edit: If you count liquid's day yesterday as a lan, they have only beaten selfless and cloud 9 on lan over the last 4 lans.
But HugoBallzak, it's not about winning, it's about participating and having fun, don't ever let anybody convince you otherwise. They say it's "competitive" Counter-Strike. I think it's no different from my 5 year old little cousin's soccer league. It's about enjoying one's self, and who knows if we're lucky maybe we stumble on 1.2 million dollars more or less by mistake. Now let's go watch 12 hours of Bob Ross.
There's a good balance between being cancerous and competitive. Oh well, hard to argue with hardcore simple fanboys :>
I don't think I'm a s1mple "fanboy", I don't follow him, I only cared because he was on TL. Now that he's not, I really don't care about him or what he does.
It's funny though, you say there's a good balance between cancerous and competitive. Imagine for a moment that we learned that Messi's cancer made him more competitive... Then we'd have to conclude that he was balancing his cancer pretty well.
I was moreso talking about HugoBallzak who apparently enjoys S1mples "ballzaks" quite a bit.
On May 26 2016 02:17 ptbl wrote: Does anyone think that Liquid is playing worse under their new coach peacemaker? Maybe he should stop IGL and give it back to the players.
Rome wasn't built in a day.
Yeah, but when Hiko joined the team, we saw a noticeable improvement even though they were struggling. Same thing happened with GBJames, Elige, and Simple. There was always a honeymoon stage.
With peacemaker, we don't see any noticeable improvement. Heck, I would say their play has gotten worse.
i don't understand the coach blame, it's time to look at something else when you have gone through multiple coaches and still losing in the same manner.
On May 25 2016 22:58 HugoBallzak wrote: That Koosta molly round throw is dumbfounding but I cant look away. Where is the poster or posters who constantly say dumb things like "S1mple's dumb plays lose TL rounds"? I feel like you could plug hiko into almost any NA team and that team will perform better than liquid. Elige never played so good as when s1mple was on this roster. Nitro is just nothing special at this point and has probably already peaked. Adren is a known quantity, koosta is a disappointment. TL management should have just told these guys to stfu and deal with a 'toxic' player because that toxic player actually performs on lan and has fans. If they didn't like it they should have been kicked. Legit can't get over how disappointed I am by TL's mismanagement after looking so promising for a month or two this year.
Edit: If you count liquid's day yesterday as a lan, they have only beaten selfless and cloud 9 on lan over the last 4 lans.
But HugoBallzak, it's not about winning, it's about participating and having fun, don't ever let anybody convince you otherwise. They say it's "competitive" Counter-Strike. I think it's no different from my 5 year old little cousin's soccer league. It's about enjoying one's self, and who knows if we're lucky maybe we stumble on 1.2 million dollars more or less by mistake. Now let's go watch 12 hours of Bob Ross.
There's a good balance between being cancerous and competitive. Oh well, hard to argue with hardcore simple fanboys :>
I don't think I'm a s1mple "fanboy", I don't follow him, I only cared because he was on TL. Now that he's not, I really don't care about him or what he does.
It's funny though, you say there's a good balance between cancerous and competitive. Imagine for a moment that we learned that Messi's cancer made him more competitive... Then we'd have to conclude that he was balancing his cancer pretty well.
I was moreso talking about HugoBallzak who apparently enjoys S1mples "ballzaks" quite a bit.
Meh I'm fine with some ball play from the guy. I have to say that I too am rather sad with the current state of affairs.
On May 26 2016 02:22 Kuroeeah wrote: i don't understand the coach blame, it's time to look at something else when you have gone through multiple coaches and still losing in the same manner.
I think the point people are making is that Liquid has gotten worse under this new coach.
On May 26 2016 02:22 Kuroeeah wrote: i don't understand the coach blame, it's time to look at something else when you have gone through multiple coaches and still losing in the same manner.
I think the point people are making is that Liquid has gotten worse under this new coach.
he's only been coach for a short while and it's impossible to be sure unless you have an insider on what's led to liquid peforming bad. i hear they did "okay" online with this new roster but that doesn't translate to lan performance, they swapped rosters and so on.
it's more telling that they lose by living up to their meme in choking than anything else that perhaps the coach isn't actually the issue.
On May 26 2016 02:22 Kuroeeah wrote: i don't understand the coach blame, it's time to look at something else when you have gone through multiple coaches and still losing in the same manner.
I think the point people are making is that Liquid has gotten worse under this new coach.
The point you are making. No one else gives Peacemaker the fault. He ks the coach for like 10 days. There's something wrong with the team. Too early to say if it's the coachs fault
On May 26 2016 02:22 Kuroeeah wrote: i don't understand the coach blame, it's time to look at something else when you have gone through multiple coaches and still losing in the same manner.
I think the point people are making is that Liquid has gotten worse under this new coach.
Why do you mention "the people" instead of using the first person pronoun?
On May 26 2016 02:22 Kuroeeah wrote: i don't understand the coach blame, it's time to look at something else when you have gone through multiple coaches and still losing in the same manner.
I think the point people are making is that Liquid has gotten worse under this new coach.
You are literally the only person saying that. What people ? I like how you add think to it as If you are unsure aswell ..
On May 26 2016 02:22 Kuroeeah wrote: i don't understand the coach blame, it's time to look at something else when you have gone through multiple coaches and still losing in the same manner.
I think the point people are making is that Liquid has gotten worse under this new coach.
You are literally the only person saying that. What people ?
its now confirmed that pbtl is a sockpuppet account for the anti-TLIDF
On May 26 2016 02:22 Kuroeeah wrote: i don't understand the coach blame, it's time to look at something else when you have gone through multiple coaches and still losing in the same manner.
I think the point people are making is that Liquid has gotten worse under this new coach.
You are literally the only person saying that. What people ?
its now confirmed that pbtl is a sockpuppet account for the anti-TLIDF
On May 26 2016 02:17 ptbl wrote: Does anyone think that Liquid is playing worse under their new coach peacemaker? Maybe he should stop IGL and give it back to the players.
You're not even trying anymore are you.
Peacemaker arrived less than two weeks ago.
Next.
--
In a serious thought, i wouldnt expect peacemakers effect to start taking effect for about ~8 weeks. But i wonder what sort of effect he will have on them & what sort of coach he will be, at this point i think its clear that liquid needs some "mental" help outside / surrounding the game and not just in it, can peacemaker offer that or should they perhaps seek some sort of sports psychologist like thorin/everyones been suggesting.
I like moe's point about blowing this roster up. Need to kick everyone but hiko and bring s1mple back. Pick up any 3 NA players with thick skin and you instantly have a better team.
On May 26 2016 03:02 HugoBallzak wrote: I like moe's point about blowing this roster up. Need to kick everyone but hiko and bring s1mple back. Pick up any 3 NA players with thick skin and you instantly have a better team.
I think the team would be shit anyway then. At that moment youd have Hiko, simple and 3 bots. Now you atleast have players that can play CS :D
On May 26 2016 03:02 HugoBallzak wrote: I like moe's point about blowing this roster up. Need to kick everyone but hiko and bring s1mple back. Pick up any 3 NA players with thick skin and you instantly have a better team.
I think the team would be shit anyway then. At that moment youd have Hiko, simple and 3 bots. Now you atleast have players that can play CS :D
On May 26 2016 03:02 HugoBallzak wrote: I like moe's point about blowing this roster up. Need to kick everyone but hiko and bring s1mple back. Pick up any 3 NA players with thick skin and you instantly have a better team.
I think the team would be shit anyway then. At that moment youd have Hiko, simple and 3 bots. Now you atleast have players that can play CS :D
I honestly hope hiko leaves for CLG.
What, so he can go lose games with peanut brains? I don't see any difference in that.
yes, the TL plot is literally EVERY FUCKING BOSS BATTLE IN EVERY SHOUNEN BATTLE MANGA
sadly this is going to be the one that they lose to realize their powerlessness and go back to train harder.
elige already ranting on twitter about shitty practice, so the battle manga meme will prevail. the fan in me wants TL to beat LG as payback for the coldzera 4k at Columbus, but my meme magick isnt that strong
yes, the TL plot is literally EVERY FUCKING BOSS BATTLE IN EVERY SHOUNEN BATTLE MANGA
sadly this is going to be the one that they lose to realize their powerlessness and go back to train harder.
elige already ranting on twitter about shitty practice, so the battle manga meme will prevail. the fan in me wants TL to beat LG as payback for the coldzera 4k at Columbus, but my meme magick isnt that strong
Oh... well to be honest, work ethic is important obviously, you can scrim as much as you want, but it has to be the right kind of practice. Teams like Fnatic and LG arent good because of their tactics or just hardwork. Mid round and endgame play is something you work on by understanding your team mates, and reading the game well on the fly, yes practice is also the way to do that but its not something you teach each other to do. Its something you need to pick up and observe as you play with your team and good team players will pick that up over the course of 6 months or a year or however long the core has been together,. I dono.. seems like a bit of a lazy excuse but I'd give him the benefit of the doubt.
If your practice is that bad you arent going to get to big leads in the first place. So it cant be just that now that I think about it.
the reason fnatic and LG are so damn good is because they have the "hive mind" -- they have trained themselves to allocate a majority of their decisions makings and game play to be subconscious, not unlike forming habits through training and discipline. Thus the big decision making process for them isnt hindered by the chaos of the round, etc. Its why their game play is so smooth and why they remain calm when down in the round. You can see when TL fucks up something, they just go into "oh shit" mode and mentally kill themselves, not unlike astralis
Liquid players are delusional. I think only hiko really gets it. How can bad practice be the fault of james? They weren't even good at all in 2015 and james wasn't there for most of it. Elige is trying to say the major was a fluke, but is having a superstar player carry you through a tournament and open up rounds for others to perform better really a fluke? That is kind of how cs is played. Elige played so much better with s1mple on the team so I don't understand how he doesn't see that. He cites Malmo as a reason for the major being a fluke but LG also got eliminated by tyloo and it was obvious in their play that internal issues with s1mple had taken over. Really seems to me like maybe elige is the problem and not just nitro. They are still suffering from the same thing I think CLG did for a while which is thinking they are better than they are just because they got picked up by a good org.
On May 26 2016 09:24 amazingxkcd wrote: the reason fnatic and LG are so damn good is because they have the "hive mind" -- they have trained themselves to allocate a majority of their decisions makings and game play to be subconscious, not unlike forming habits through training and discipline. Thus the big decision making process for them isnt hindered by the chaos of the round, etc. Its why their game play is so smooth and why they remain calm when down in the round. You can see when TL fucks up something, they just go into "oh shit" mode and mentally kill themselves, not unlike astralis
Yeah but neither of this things involved them playing for an extensive period of time. Fnatics 2015 showed that style pretty quick after forming and same for this iteration of LG. Frankly to a large degree, Some combinatios of players just get it and some dont. Its not just training, its like musicians, some can play in the pocket and some just cant.
On May 26 2016 09:24 amazingxkcd wrote: the reason fnatic and LG are so damn good is because they have the "hive mind" -- they have trained themselves to allocate a majority of their decisions makings and game play to be subconscious, not unlike forming habits through training and discipline. Thus the big decision making process for them isnt hindered by the chaos of the round, etc. Its why their game play is so smooth and why they remain calm when down in the round. You can see when TL fucks up something, they just go into "oh shit" mode and mentally kill themselves, not unlike astralis
On May 26 2016 09:24 amazingxkcd wrote: the reason fnatic and LG are so damn good is because they have the "hive mind" -- they have trained themselves to allocate a majority of their decisions makings and game play to be subconscious, not unlike forming habits through training and discipline. Thus the big decision making process for them isnt hindered by the chaos of the round, etc. Its why their game play is so smooth and why they remain calm when down in the round. You can see when TL fucks up something, they just go into "oh shit" mode and mentally kill themselves, not unlike astralis
This was very well said. +1
Hive mind OP i all team sports! Wish more people would understand this.
On May 26 2016 17:35 Ragnarork wrote: Hive mind in a team feels like the equivalent of muscle memory but on a team level.
im thinking about writing something on this topic -- its interesting since there's a variety of sports examples that i can pull from to explain this hive mind feeling; the Moscow 5 is my favorite example
If people are interested elige is going hard on GBJames
No fucks given, confirmed gbjames was a fraud
How was he a fraud? Didn't it leak or something, the guy made like $20k/year which is something like the average wage of a McDonalds worker? No one is saying shit like Timmy's a fraud he's bad at flipping burgers. Nah man you make 20k you're expected to be shit at your job or you're expected to do something easy. If he had done a good job for $20k I'd have been a whole lot more offended. As it is you can't blame a 20k dude for doing a 20k job. You can blame an org for renting a bad cheerleader.
If people are interested elige is going hard on GBJames
No fucks given, confirmed gbjames was a fraud
How was he a fraud? Didn't it leak or something, the guy made like $20k/year which is something like the average wage of a McDonalds worker? No one is saying shit like Timmy's a fraud he's bad at flipping burgers. Nah man you make 20k you're expected to be shit at your job or you're expected to do something easy. If he had done a good job for $20k I'd have been a whole lot more offended. As it is you can't blame a 20k dude for doing a 20k job. You can blame an org for renting a bad cheerleader.
True that. Also, the concept of taking anything elige says with anything other than a grain of salt. These dudes will look for ANYONE to scapegoat while taking none of the blame. Even adren is on record defending gbjames as a decent coach or is adren somehow less credible than elige all of a sudden?
If people are interested elige is going hard on GBJames
No fucks given, confirmed gbjames was a fraud
How was he a fraud? Didn't it leak or something, the guy made like $20k/year which is something like the average wage of a McDonalds worker? No one is saying shit like Timmy's a fraud he's bad at flipping burgers. Nah man you make 20k you're expected to be shit at your job or you're expected to do something easy. If he had done a good job for $20k I'd have been a whole lot more offended. As it is you can't blame a 20k dude for doing a 20k job. You can blame an org for renting a bad cheerleader.
the real issue though is that he was presenting himself as a $100k guy doing a $100k job, except he didn't even even do a $20k job with your analogy
If people are interested elige is going hard on GBJames
No fucks given, confirmed gbjames was a fraud
How was he a fraud? Didn't it leak or something, the guy made like $20k/year which is something like the average wage of a McDonalds worker? No one is saying shit like Timmy's a fraud he's bad at flipping burgers. Nah man you make 20k you're expected to be shit at your job or you're expected to do something easy. If he had done a good job for $20k I'd have been a whole lot more offended. As it is you can't blame a 20k dude for doing a 20k job. You can blame an org for renting a bad cheerleader.
the real issue though is that he was presenting himself as a $100k guy doing a $100k job, except he didn't even even do a $20k job with your analogy
I have no idea how you see him describing himself as a 100k guy doing a 100k job. The guy was on the defensive and he wasn't getting paid enough for the amount of shit he got. What 20k guy is under that much public pressure? Hell, he was doing a job which coincided with many months of Liquid playing as good as they ever did (and possibly ever will). I'd say he earned his 20k, if nothing else because he took the job for that amount.
People talk about work ethic, for 20k I admittedly wouldn't have any. I'd flip my burgers in solemn silence, contemplating death.
This entire idea that coaches need to be IGL's if you want to compete at the top is so bogus. Cloud 9 had the most success it ever had with stunna backing them up. Fnatic the best team of all time have Vuggo who seemingly doesn't do anything in regards to tactics. NIP went 87-0 with no coach at all. LG have zews who doesn't seem to be involved with calling strats. LDLC won a major with a sc2 dude behind them. Tempo Storm has had most of its success after switching to boltz for IGL from peacemaker. I think it is fair to say that there are more examples of top teams where the coach doesn't actually call or make strats than there are teams with coaches who do so. James' job was to handle things outside the game and it was adren's job to call the strats. Quit trying to rewrite history that it was james' fault that adren was a terrible IGL.
On May 27 2016 00:00 HugoBallzak wrote: This entire idea that coaches need to be IGL's if you want to compete at the top is so bogus. Cloud 9 had the most success it ever had with stunna backing them up. Fnatic the best team of all time have Vuggo who seemingly doesn't do anything in regards to tactics. NIP went 87-0 with no coach at all. LG have zews who doesn't seem to be involved with calling strats. LDLC won a major with a sc2 dude behind them. Tempo Storm has had most of its success after switching to boltz for IGL from peacemaker. I think it is fair to say that there are more examples of top teams where the coach doesn't actually call or make strats than there are teams with coaches who do so. James' job was to handle things outside the game and it was adren's job to call the strats. Quit trying to rewrite history that it was james' fault that adren was a terrible IGL.
On May 27 2016 00:00 HugoBallzak wrote: This entire idea that coaches need to be IGL's if you want to compete at the top is so bogus. Cloud 9 had the most success it ever had with stunna backing them up. Fnatic the best team of all time have Vuggo who seemingly doesn't do anything in regards to tactics. NIP went 87-0 with no coach at all. LG have zews who doesn't seem to be involved with calling strats. LDLC won a major with a sc2 dude behind them. Tempo Storm has had most of its success after switching to boltz for IGL from peacemaker. I think it is fair to say that there are more examples of top teams where the coach doesn't actually call or make strats than there are teams with coaches who do so. James' job was to handle things outside the game and it was adren's job to call the strats. Quit trying to rewrite history that it was james' fault that adren was a terrible IGL.
On May 27 2016 00:00 HugoBallzak wrote: This entire idea that coaches need to be IGL's if you want to compete at the top is so bogus. Cloud 9 had the most success it ever had with stunna backing them up. Fnatic the best team of all time have Vuggo who seemingly doesn't do anything in regards to tactics. NIP went 87-0 with no coach at all. LG have zews who doesn't seem to be involved with calling strats. LDLC won a major with a sc2 dude behind them. Tempo Storm has had most of its success after switching to boltz for IGL from peacemaker. I think it is fair to say that there are more examples of top teams where the coach doesn't actually call or make strats than there are teams with coaches who do so. James' job was to handle things outside the game and it was adren's job to call the strats. Quit trying to rewrite history that it was james' fault that adren was a terrible IGL.
my view on the igl/coach as explained http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/cs-go/502782-the-lombardi-factor is that it really is up to the team itself to make that judgement. i dont think its appropriate to make a blanket statement that coaches have to be igls or that coaches cant be the igls.
On May 27 2016 00:09 amazingxkcd wrote: my view on the igl/coach as explained http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/cs-go/502782-the-lombardi-factor is that it really is up to the team itself to make that judgement. i dont think its appropriate to make a blanket statement that coaches have to be igls or that coaches cant be the igls.
Yeah exactly, so where my question is still, where is HE getting the notion that people think coaches have to be IGL's ?
I have seen plenty of posts either here or hltv or reddit claiming that peacemaker becoming the IGL for liquid is going to magically make them a better team. If that is the goal than why not drop adren and pick up somebody who can frag, or maybe even nitro because he seems to struggle in that area as well. Neither of these guys are bringing IGL'ing to the team any longer and if they cant frag either what is the point? Here is Nazgul himself on the plan:
"The past few weeks has been a time of change for our CS:GO team. Despite the tumultuous happenings (s1mple, and parting ways with our coach James), our players continued to show up and perform (and possibly choke a bit I know, I know), competing and winning against some of the best rosters North America has to offer. We’ve been working to create the much needed calm that will allow us to build towards becoming the world class team we aspire to be. With Luis, we bring in a talented coach who has a wealth of strategical knowledge and guidance. Out of all the candidates we had for the coaching spot it was clear to us that Luis was the way to go. It is no secret we have been searching on how to optimize our IGL role, and we aim for Luis to take that spot on the team. Welcome to the team, peacemaker! " -Nazgul
On May 27 2016 00:00 HugoBallzak wrote: This entire idea that coaches need to be IGL's if you want to compete at the top is so bogus. Cloud 9 had the most success it ever had with stunna backing them up. Fnatic the best team of all time have Vuggo who seemingly doesn't do anything in regards to tactics. NIP went 87-0 with no coach at all. LG have zews who doesn't seem to be involved with calling strats. LDLC won a major with a sc2 dude behind them. Tempo Storm has had most of its success after switching to boltz for IGL from peacemaker. I think it is fair to say that there are more examples of top teams where the coach doesn't actually call or make strats than there are teams with coaches who do so. James' job was to handle things outside the game and it was adren's job to call the strats. Quit trying to rewrite history that it was james' fault that adren was a terrible IGL.
while navi has not won a major yet, starix still maintains full IGL role as the coach afaik, so i wouldnt make such an assertation. hell even nip now need threat to call for them if they want to do anything. what works for fnatic or other teams doesnt work for every team
You're talking about Peace and Liquid. Your post was
This entire idea that coaches need to be IGL's if you want to compete at the top is so bogus
which is a generality and is quite different.
Starix alone makes this statement bogus.
That doesn't mean it's the solution and that all the team should follow it (LG doesn't do it for example and they're fine with that, the LEGIJA period of Kinguin wasn't that convincing, they could do it on their own and didn't keep him in the end), but it shows that it's definitely not idiotic.
Oh Please, there are plenty of people in this community who seem to think that a coach who IGL's is the way of the future and I am saying that this has actually proven to be the exception to the rule that player IGL's seem to be way more successful. 'Starix alone' doesn't make my statement bogus. I never said it was impossible for a coach to IGL a top team.
Also, a coach like starix or even kuben and threat seem to be way more effective because they have actually PLAYED with their team's core in the past and have a strong chemistry together actually built on having played with each other at a high level. I just don't see how a guy who has pretty much no experience ever playing with his players can successfully IGL them at the highest level.
On May 27 2016 00:24 HugoBallzak wrote: Oh Please, there are plenty of people in this community who seem to think that a coach who IGL's is the way of the future and I am saying that this has actually proven to be the exception to the rule that player IGL's seem to be way more successful. 'Starix alone' doesn't make my statement bogus. I never said it was impossible for a coach to IGL a top team.
Also, a coach like starix or even kuben and threat seem to be way more effective because they have actually PLAYED with their team's core in the past and have a strong chemistry together actually built on having played with each other at a high level. I just don't see how a guy who has pretty much no experience ever playing with his players can successfully IGL them at the highest level.
Dono any of those people. they are idiots. No one recently in the recent context of your comment made any such assertion so if anything it still feels a bit out of the blue.
If certain people feel that way. Go tell them. Dont preach to the choir.
I do agree with the point that a good coach that has played with his players at a higher level will be a better coach much quicker. I dont agree that someone who hasnt played with them or at the highest level cant be a good coach either and eventually maybe even be better than that other type of coach.
Infact in some ways if you have played with someone at a certain point may mean that you will try to implement things in ways that might not work anymore either because you can have biases in your head (even if it is somewhat subconscious) a fresh coach wont have that problem and can understand his players to. Just one of the many things I can think of but cba to keep adding.
There is plenty of evidence outside CS of coaches working pretty well. I dont see why similar affects cant be achieved here.
On May 27 2016 00:24 HugoBallzak wrote: Oh Please, there are plenty of people in this community who seem to think that a coach who IGL's is the way of the future and I am saying that this has actually proven to be the exception to the rule that player IGL's seem to be way more successful. 'Starix alone' doesn't make my statement bogus. I never said it was impossible for a coach to IGL a top team.
Also, a coach like starix or even kuben and threat seem to be way more effective because they have actually PLAYED with their team's core in the past and have a strong chemistry together actually built on having played with each other at a high level. I just don't see how a guy who has pretty much no experience ever playing with his players can successfully IGL them at the highest level.
Threat only played with NiP's core for like 3 days, might as well be 0.
On May 27 2016 00:24 HugoBallzak wrote: Oh Please, there are plenty of people in this community who seem to think that a coach who IGL's is the way of the future and I am saying that this has actually proven to be the exception to the rule that player IGL's seem to be way more successful. 'Starix alone' doesn't make my statement bogus. I never said it was impossible for a coach to IGL a top team.
Also, a coach like starix or even kuben and threat seem to be way more effective because they have actually PLAYED with their team's core in the past and have a strong chemistry together actually built on having played with each other at a high level. I just don't see how a guy who has pretty much no experience ever playing with his players can successfully IGL them at the highest level.
Threat only played with NiP's core for like 3 days, might as well be 0.
He played with them in 1.6 aswell, albeit briefly and not even close to as extensively as a Starix or a Kuben, but Kuben isnt an IGL anyway.
On May 27 2016 00:24 HugoBallzak wrote: Oh Please, there are plenty of people in this community who seem to think that a coach who IGL's is the way of the future and I am saying that this has actually proven to be the exception to the rule that player IGL's seem to be way more successful. 'Starix alone' doesn't make my statement bogus. I never said it was impossible for a coach to IGL a top team.
Also, a coach like starix or even kuben and threat seem to be way more effective because they have actually PLAYED with their team's core in the past and have a strong chemistry together actually built on having played with each other at a high level. I just don't see how a guy who has pretty much no experience ever playing with his players can successfully IGL them at the highest level.
Threat only played with NiP's core for like 3 days, might as well be 0.
He played with them in 1.6 aswell, albeit briefly and not even close to as extensively as a Starix or a Kuben, but Kuben isnt an IGL anyway.
Them? I can see he briefly played with GTR and f0rest for a couple of months but left before Xizt came in. He never played with friberg and even less with pyth . So that's not even half the team, and it was in 2010, I was still shitting my diapers.
On May 27 2016 00:24 HugoBallzak wrote: Oh Please, there are plenty of people in this community who seem to think that a coach who IGL's is the way of the future and I am saying that this has actually proven to be the exception to the rule that player IGL's seem to be way more successful. 'Starix alone' doesn't make my statement bogus. I never said it was impossible for a coach to IGL a top team.
Also, a coach like starix or even kuben and threat seem to be way more effective because they have actually PLAYED with their team's core in the past and have a strong chemistry together actually built on having played with each other at a high level. I just don't see how a guy who has pretty much no experience ever playing with his players can successfully IGL them at the highest level.
Threat only played with NiP's core for like 3 days, might as well be 0.
He played with them in 1.6 aswell, albeit briefly and not even close to as extensively as a Starix or a Kuben, but Kuben isnt an IGL anyway.
Them? I can see he briefly played with GTR and f0rest for a couple of months but left before Xizt came in. He never played with friberg and even less with pyth . So that's not even half the team, and it was in 2010, I was still shitting my diapers.
Yeah but he was talking about core. You could argue that Xzist and Friberg are core too, but still he has played with the 2 best players on the team and has known them for a while which is the point. There is a reason why Natu was terrible and Threat is not and its not just because he is in general just a better coach than Natu. Imo Natu is super over rated.
And technically you cant have played with all 5 players on a team you are coaching unless you played with them on different teams or as a sub which isnt the dynamic we are talking about either.
On May 27 2016 00:24 HugoBallzak wrote: Oh Please, there are plenty of people in this community who seem to think that a coach who IGL's is the way of the future and I am saying that this has actually proven to be the exception to the rule that player IGL's seem to be way more successful. 'Starix alone' doesn't make my statement bogus. I never said it was impossible for a coach to IGL a top team.
Also, a coach like starix or even kuben and threat seem to be way more effective because they have actually PLAYED with their team's core in the past and have a strong chemistry together actually built on having played with each other at a high level. I just don't see how a guy who has pretty much no experience ever playing with his players can successfully IGL them at the highest level.
Threat only played with NiP's core for like 3 days, might as well be 0.
He played with them in 1.6 aswell, albeit briefly and not even close to as extensively as a Starix or a Kuben, but Kuben isnt an IGL anyway.
Them? I can see he briefly played with GTR and f0rest for a couple of months but left before Xizt came in. He never played with friberg and even less with pyth . So that's not even half the team, and it was in 2010, I was still shitting my diapers.
Yeah but he was talking about core. You could argue that Xzist and Friberg are core too, but still he has played with the 2 best players on the team which is the point.
And technically you cant have played with all 5 players on a team you are coaching unless you played with them on different teams or as a sub which isnt the dynamic we are talking about either.
I'm just saying it's remote enough to be a nonfactor or almost. Different game, different era of counterstrike. Comparing Threat to Starix or Kuben seems like a stretch. I understand but yeh.
On May 27 2016 00:24 HugoBallzak wrote: Oh Please, there are plenty of people in this community who seem to think that a coach who IGL's is the way of the future and I am saying that this has actually proven to be the exception to the rule that player IGL's seem to be way more successful. 'Starix alone' doesn't make my statement bogus. I never said it was impossible for a coach to IGL a top team.
Also, a coach like starix or even kuben and threat seem to be way more effective because they have actually PLAYED with their team's core in the past and have a strong chemistry together actually built on having played with each other at a high level. I just don't see how a guy who has pretty much no experience ever playing with his players can successfully IGL them at the highest level.
Threat only played with NiP's core for like 3 days, might as well be 0.
He played with them in 1.6 aswell, albeit briefly and not even close to as extensively as a Starix or a Kuben, but Kuben isnt an IGL anyway.
Them? I can see he briefly played with GTR and f0rest for a couple of months but left before Xizt came in. He never played with friberg and even less with pyth . So that's not even half the team, and it was in 2010, I was still shitting my diapers.
Yeah but he was talking about core. You could argue that Xzist and Friberg are core too, but still he has played with the 2 best players on the team which is the point.
And technically you cant have played with all 5 players on a team you are coaching unless you played with them on different teams or as a sub which isnt the dynamic we are talking about either.
I'm just saying it's remote enough to be a nonfactor or almost. Different game, different era of counterstrike. Comparing Threat to Starix or Kuben seems like a stretch. I understand but yeh.
Different game and different era of counterstrike is the same thing.
NIP is working for a reason its not just because Threat is really smart about the game. Although that helps. Even little things like trusting or having confidence in the person stems from your experience with them. And if Forest and GRT are listening to them then the rest of the team has like no reason to not follow suite.Not just the tactical side of things. So I wouldnt call it a non factor. Clearly you do, thats fine with me.
Also I wasnt comparing him to Starix or Kuben, in terms of having history.
To me he is better coach than Kuben and Starix when it comes to understanding in my opinion. And he was maybe a slightly better player than Kuben and about the same level as Starix back in the day. Thats a non factor.
Having history with players on the team is not a non factor. if you are basing this of some liquipedia or HLTCV entry showing time spent on the same teams or something then thats a pretty silly way to look at it. Its similar to looking at player ratings and crowning them best player.
I feel like that might actually be smart, can't outplay them traditionally might aswell try on a new map where they don't have a lot of practice on, randomness factor n shit.
On May 27 2016 03:54 amazingxkcd wrote: if that is their plan to surprise the world with the nuke pick, then they better have a gameplan for T side at least
Im really interested. Ive played one nuke game and it was pretty fun. But cant really have an opinion on the map myself unless I see pros play it.
Now we know what Peacemaker was doing all the time, getting Nuke to work as the first pro team is really a good thing. It forces enemy to veto it and gives you more options.
Also I like the auto-shoty there, it is pretty strong there and still garbage if a T picks it up.
i was stewie's biggest skeptic and it's still kinda funny when he occasionally jumps through smokes for no real reason but just watching cloud 9 games, he really is solidifying himself as a great player.
I am so HYPED for tomorrow. I expect a 2-0 for Luminosity but I am hoping for a 2-1 going either way. I am leaving from work early to get back home to watch TBS. LETS GO!!!! Party @ my house if you live in Portland. Pizza n beer.
On May 27 2016 15:43 evaunit01 wrote: I am so HYPED for tomorrow. I expect a 2-0 for Luminosity but I am hoping for a 2-1 going either way. I am leaving from work early to get back home to watch TBS. LETS GO!!!! Party @ my house if you live in Portland. Pizza n beer.
ill be going to the local b dubs to watch this. trying to see if i can get coworkers to ocme with me
I missed week 1, but I will be setting my DVR to record this every week from now on. So Hype that I can get some CS right on my TV (and skip through the commercials by watching it later :-))
On May 28 2016 03:00 pNRG wrote: I missed week 1, but I will be setting my DVR to record this every week from now on. So Hype that I can get some CS right on my TV (and skip through the commercials by watching it later :-))
/e P.S. I love Semmler.
You havent missed anything. TV game is airing tonight at 10 eastern on TBS.
On May 28 2016 03:00 pNRG wrote: I missed week 1, but I will be setting my DVR to record this every week from now on. So Hype that I can get some CS right on my TV (and skip through the commercials by watching it later :-))
On May 28 2016 03:00 pNRG wrote: I missed week 1, but I will be setting my DVR to record this every week from now on. So Hype that I can get some CS right on my TV (and skip through the commercials by watching it later :-))
On May 28 2016 11:53 Hider wrote: With Stewie being in godmode, Slemmy can get away with being dogshit.
In his defense its one of those situations where you only get to take bad duels when your team has already given up the round. Or there is nothing left for him to kill. Not saying he wouldve put up better numbers but there is an actual lack of opportunity there.
Also lol at Anders and Semmler making it sound like 9-6 is some massive upset scoreline for Cloud 9. I mean its a big deal but its not game breaking lol.
On May 28 2016 13:48 plasmidghost wrote: I wonder what TBS will do since this is going to go way over the scheduled time
I doubt they have anything else to show at 1 AM anyway. They are probably more than happy.
Also, only now I saw the vetoes, I still don't understand how LG dont consider train and overpass their best maps
ye that i didnt make sense of. they burned a ban on nuke (why)?
C9 banned nuke. LG banned cache in the first phase and picked mirage(they should've picked train IMO). In the second phase c9 banned train and LG banned overpass (wtf), letting dust2, a map they didn't even play 2 months ago, in the pool
On May 28 2016 13:48 plasmidghost wrote: I wonder what TBS will do since this is going to go way over the scheduled time
I doubt they have anything else to show at 1 AM anyway. They are probably more than happy.
Also, only now I saw the vetoes, I still don't understand how LG dont consider train and overpass their best maps
ye that i didnt make sense of. they burned a ban on nuke (why)?
C9 banned nuke. LG banned cache in the first phase and picked mirage(they should've picked train IMO). In the second phase c9 banned train and LG banned overpass (wtf), letting dust2, a map they didn't even play 2 months ago, in the pool
On May 28 2016 13:48 plasmidghost wrote: I wonder what TBS will do since this is going to go way over the scheduled time
I doubt they have anything else to show at 1 AM anyway. They are probably more than happy.
Also, only now I saw the vetoes, I still don't understand how LG dont consider train and overpass their best maps
ye that i didnt make sense of. they burned a ban on nuke (why)?
C9 banned nuke. LG banned cache in the first phase and picked mirage(they should've picked train IMO). In the second phase c9 banned train and LG banned overpass (wtf), letting dust2, a map they didn't even play 2 months ago, in the pool
They Play it now !!
You could see the FPL taking over Stewie as the half progressed. Dudes got skill but I'm worried the Novelty of his run through smoke plays will run thin pretty quick. It did in this series. LG learnt to play him hard.
ive started to like cloud9 a lot during this series. despite losing the 2nd map in a spectacular fashion and being down 1-14 on the third map, they dont scoff at each other or anything. looks they are a real team.
What a great set of maps and match. Being 30, I remember watching CPL and HLTV back in the 1.6 days this is quite a treat. CS being done proper on TV! CGS looks so far behind us now. Thank you TBS! Great showing by both teams, props to C9 for stepping it up. I want to buy a LG Coldzera jersey man!
On May 28 2016 11:53 Hider wrote: With Stewie being in godmode, Slemmy can get away with being dogshit.
In his defense its one of those situations where you only get to take bad duels when your team has already given up the round. Or there is nothing left for him to kill. Not saying he wouldve put up better numbers but there is an actual lack of opportunity there.
Also lol at Anders and Semmler making it sound like 9-6 is some massive upset scoreline for Cloud 9. I mean its a big deal but its not game breaking lol.
EDIT: OK now thats a legit surprise.
Problem with Slemmy is that he loses 80% of the duels that are supposed to be somewhat even. Stewie2k probably won like 60-65% throughout the series which is pretty impressive given the skill level of the opponent.
I hope for C9 that they find an ingame-leader that is at least a decent fragger.
On May 28 2016 11:53 Hider wrote: With Stewie being in godmode, Slemmy can get away with being dogshit.
In his defense its one of those situations where you only get to take bad duels when your team has already given up the round. Or there is nothing left for him to kill. Not saying he wouldve put up better numbers but there is an actual lack of opportunity there.
Also lol at Anders and Semmler making it sound like 9-6 is some massive upset scoreline for Cloud 9. I mean its a big deal but its not game breaking lol.
EDIT: OK now thats a legit surprise.
Problem with Slemmy is that he loses 80% of the duels that are supposed to be somewhat even. Stewie2k probably won like 60-65% throughout the series which is pretty impressive given the skill level of the opponent.
I hope for C9 that they find an ingame-leader that is at least a decent fragger.
Yeah he was pretty bad at some points. But he won them some rounds too.
Everybody was bad on D2 though.
On May 28 2016 15:20 evaunit01 wrote: What a great set of maps and match. Being 30, I remember watching CPL and HLTV back in the 1.6 days this is quite a treat. CS being done proper on TV! CGS looks so far behind us now. Thank you TBS! Great showing by both teams, props to C9 for stepping it up. I want to buy a LG Coldzera jersey man!
yeah man I know what you mean, I used to watch HLTV with a shitty 256k back in Pakistan. All the way back in the early 1.5 CPL's. CGS wasnt really that impressive tbh, but probably also because half the world hated that game.. This was really nice.
On May 29 2016 06:09 Ragnarork wrote: Some numbers here, although I have a hard time analyzing what they're worth for the TV part.
Streaming wise, they were acceptable but not amazing either.
I laughed a bit at the "#1 on twitch" because considerint the time, there wasn't much competition for that anyway.
For perpective, usually that timeslot has old BBT reruns and the viewership for E-league was 3 times less than the previous weeks BBT reruns.
To be fair that was expected though and you also have to consider that theres alot of stop and start and the event normally runs over the designated timeslot.
Also Friday night at 10 is literally the graveyard off timeslot as far as young people are concerned.
It's supposed to start at 18:00. I don't get the issue with the calendar, I can see the matches on it with the correct time (or was it just updated.. ?)
That ELEAGUE intro footage where there's a cartridge and the rim mysteriously disappears is strange. That'll lead to a failure to eject for sure. You don't want that.
On June 01 2016 20:01 Ota Solgryn wrote: The group matches. Are they purely for seeding for the bracket matches? And only the team winning the brackets moves on?
There's last chance spots based on the points for the teams that didn't make it to the playoffs after groups IIRC.
On June 01 2016 20:01 Ota Solgryn wrote: The group matches. Are they purely for seeding for the bracket matches? And only the team winning the brackets moves on?
There's last chance spots based on the points for the teams that didn't make it to the playoffs after groups IIRC.
Ok, becuase if only one team is moving on anyway, then these group games are pretty much irrelevant.
2nd place gets invite to last chance quals, 3rd-4th need to play for as many points as they can to get invite to last chance quals. every game is fucking important
On June 01 2016 20:01 Ota Solgryn wrote: The group matches. Are they purely for seeding for the bracket matches? And only the team winning the brackets moves on?
There's last chance spots based on the points for the teams that didn't make it to the playoffs after groups IIRC.
Ok, becuase if only one team is moving on anyway, then these group games are pretty much irrelevant.
There are 6 group winners that will move on to the Quarterfinals.
The remaining 2 teams will be selected from a qualifying bracket that will include
6 second place finishers and 2 third place finishers with the best record.
Ahh thanks for the clarification of the seeds etc. Guess the groups does make sense. But if G2 then now lose the first BO3 bracket are they then third?
On June 02 2016 04:34 Ota Solgryn wrote: Ahh thanks for the clarification of the seeds etc. Guess the groups does make sense. But if G2 then now lose the first BO3 bracket are they then third?
On June 02 2016 04:34 Ota Solgryn wrote: Ahh thanks for the clarification of the seeds etc. Guess the groups does make sense. But if G2 then now lose the first BO3 bracket are they then third?
Yes.
I totally dislike the system tbh. If a team managed to win all three group stage games, they should advance immediately T_T
On June 02 2016 04:34 Ota Solgryn wrote: Ahh thanks for the clarification of the seeds etc. Guess the groups does make sense. But if G2 then now lose the first BO3 bracket are they then third?
Yes.
I totally dislike the system tbh. If a team managed to win all three group stage games, they should advance immediately T_T
I agree, its kind of stupid that you can get knocked out after topping your group. The group games are basically just seeding play for a 4 team bracket that isnt even double elimination.
Tonight on TBS!!! Let your people know, spread the word. MOAR VIEWERS! Although G2 is looking to take the series I will be rooting for NiP. I am from old school CS....that brand is legendary.
On June 04 2016 15:18 evaunit01 wrote: hahaha "smithzz is also boosted". I was watching with my wife and telling her Smithzz is really dropping the ball tonight.
At some points in the game I wonder why Smithzz even picks up the AWP or Scout instead of swapping it with Shox who's a better sniper.
On June 04 2016 15:18 evaunit01 wrote: hahaha "smithzz is also boosted". I was watching with my wife and telling her Smithzz is really dropping the ball tonight.
At some points in the game I wonder why Smithzz even picks up the AWP or Scout instead of swapping it with Shox who's a better sniper.
Because shox has so much worth with rifle compared to Smithzz. It's the same situation that was on Ence with Allu and Stonde on the same team (Except Stonde was a bit better than Smithzz)
Yeah, the US changed that quite recently in an attempt to improve security. You have to properly apply for a (tourist) visa via an embassy and pay extra even if your country is a part of the VWP if you've visited Iran, Iraq, Syria or Sudan in the last 5 years.
I find it interesting how reportedly VP wouldn't work together for shit ingame because they were all toxic AF until Neo etc sat down together and decided to stick together through all odds, worked out well for them in the end.
Wonder if thats more of an unique thing or if that is possible to do more consistently.
On June 06 2016 04:17 Kipsate wrote: I find it interesting how reportedly VP wouldn't work together for shit ingame because they were all toxic AF until Neo etc sat down together and decided to stick together through all odds, worked out well for them in the end.
Wonder if thats more of an unique thing or if that is possible to do more consistently.
The VP story is interesting to me because what happened was that they had a discussion about being the team of Poland, ie carrying the pride of Poland on their backs. They all had the same goals which was to be #1 team of Poland, just were immature at the time.
Yeah man, hes western Europe, applying for and getting a visa takes like 3-4 days. Heck im just a Canadian permanent res and I got a 10 year one in like a week.
When I was just a regular Pakistani citizen it would take proof of my dads entire fortune, my school transcripts, proof of enrollment and or employment. My travel history, with itinerary's, hotel bookings, extra clearance etc etc etc.
And then maybe. maybe id get in a couple of months.
Thats what the Chinese and Eastern Euroes have to deal with aswell.
Richard Lewis really doesn't know what he is talking about. For some reason he thinks its just a mental reason that Astralis isn't picking Train, whereas its actually the teams (by far) worst map and NRGs best map.
On June 08 2016 01:29 Mozdk wrote: Why is Zonic playing?
karrigan isnt there due to visa issues
America... Why you hate Denmark?
not that black and white. USA changed ESTA rules last year which states that those who went into problem country in last 5 years need to get a visa instead of ESTA. That rule went into effect just recently which Karrigan didnt know about. It hits him as he traveled to Iran years ago for PR work for Fnatic, hence him needing to get a VISA
THAT'S THE WEAK SNIPER RIFLE NOT THE BIG ONE. You gotta assume there's some old guy who hasn't been taught to hate nerdy stuff and he's totally into it
8 on overpass is really nice, but they should have won 9 or 10 honestly.
regardless CLG is in a ridiculously good spot to qualify into the final 8 here. if they cant pull this off with the danish tilt, crowd advantage, decent map for them and score advantage all working for them, then they only have themselves to blame.
CLG should have expected that fast tec9 b hit after winning those 3 gun rounds in a row when it was 11-13 or whatever. once I saw them lose that round, I knew it was over unfortunately.
I think alot of people were underestimating TSM going into this tournament as a team with no chance to go through.
TSM has arguably been the best online NA team over the past 1-2 months. Surely they are still the worst team in the group, but I going into the tournament I rate them as the 3rd best NA team - just a bit behind C9 and pretty close to Optic (they beat them in 2 bo3s in a row).
Vs Diginitas they definitely have a fair chance to win.
Also, let me correct Thorin: Mirage is TSM's best map.
EDIT: And obviously they play like dogshit the next game after matching Fnatic very well on Cache.
On June 15 2016 06:18 Stancel wrote: what everyone's thinking: "what if olof never had wrist issues?"
Im not thinking that at all. Stomps werent unusual for them even when he was hurt. The way they play with him has more to do with just his raw aim. Hive mind and all that.
On June 15 2016 06:18 Stancel wrote: what everyone's thinking: "what if olof never had wrist issues?"
Im not thinking that at all. Stomps werent unusual for them even when he was hurt. The way they play with him has more to do with just his raw aim. Hive mind and all that.
On June 15 2016 06:18 Stancel wrote: what everyone's thinking: "what if olof never had wrist issues?"
Im not thinking that at all. Stomps werent unusual for them even when he was hurt. The way they play with him has more to do with just his raw aim. Hive mind and all that.
Still feel TSM is showing that their online results weren't a fluke. Surely they are still alot worse than Fnatic and somewhat worse than Faze, but interesting to see how they play against Dignitas. That series could be close.
On June 16 2016 04:02 Surth wrote: being a dignitas fan is living in perpetual sadness
join the fnatic fanatics, we have cookies
I feel like Fnatic has always had a fun and entertaining group of players. They were my favorite team in 1.6, with Ins, Archie, DSN, Carn, later forest, Get_Right, Gux.
Dignitas have a lot of talent and I always feel like they should do better
I do like fnatic, they seem to have a lot of fun. Like that game yesterday with the 1vs5 ninja defuse and they all just started laughing. But dignitas will always be in my heart in any game :X
On June 16 2016 04:02 Surth wrote: being a dignitas fan is living in perpetual sadness
join the fnatic fanatics, we have cookies
I feel like Fnatic has always had a fun and entertaining group of players. They were my favorite team in 1.6, with Ins, Archie, DSN, Carn, later forest, Get_Right, Gux.
Dignitas have a lot of talent and I always feel like they should do better
IIRC DSN Carn Forest Archi and Tentpole made the original big lineup + Show Spoiler +
(they took players from Iskall's Begrip team that placed surprisingly well at the CPL Sk won).
Ins came after tentpole left and I dont know when Getright Gux joined but it was way later because I wasnt following the scene those 2-3 years.
On June 16 2016 04:50 Mozdk wrote: No teams get knocked out in group stages? Is that correct?
2 teams get knocked out. The teams that lose the bo3s tomorrow are out. (they can qualify for the last chance qualifier if they are one of 2 third/fourth place finishers with the best record.)
On June 16 2016 04:50 Mozdk wrote: No teams get knocked out in group stages? Is that correct?
2 teams get knocked out. The teams that lose the bo3s today are out. (except for 2 with the best record)
No, the group matches are for seeding for the playoffs of the actual group. No team is getting knocked out at this stage. Playoffs are tomorrow.
Yeah sorry I was editing that out I thought they were playing the bracket games today didnt realise its still just fucking Wednesday.. I consider the playoff bracket as group games tbh.
On June 16 2016 04:50 Mozdk wrote: No teams get knocked out in group stages? Is that correct?
2 teams get knocked out. The teams that lose the bo3s today are out. (except for 2 with the best record)
No, the group matches are for seeding for the playoffs of the actual group. No team is getting knocked out at this stage. Playoffs are tomorrow.
Yeah sorry I was editing that out I thought they were playing the bracket games today didnt realise its still just fucking Wednesday.. I consider the playoff bracket as group games tbh.
I considered that too. I just meant if the 3rd and 4th after tomorrow were just lower seeded. There was something about seeding in the liquipedia last I checked.
On June 16 2016 05:08 Mozdk wrote: Getting 2nd or 3rd in the actual groups doesn't matter. You still face the same opponent and have no advantage. That is strange.
Correct, there is some redundancy to the group games that could have been taken care of by seeding. But then you had the liquid fail so its not totally redundant trololo But the fact that 2 of the 3/4 place finishers get to play at the last chance qualifier means that all of the games still matter and infact every round kinda matters.
On June 16 2016 05:08 Mozdk wrote: Getting 2nd or 3rd in the actual groups doesn't matter. You still face the same opponent and have no advantage. That is strange.
Correct, there is some redundancy to the group games that could have been taken care of by seeding. But then you had the liquid fail so its not totally redundant trololo But the fact that 2 of the 3/4 place finishers get to play at the last chance qualifier means that all of the games still matter and infact every round kinda matters.
Correct, the initial games give you points. 1 point per map win. This can become important for the last chance qualifier.
On June 17 2016 05:36 Otolia wrote: There is no player that annoys me more than dennis. This guy gets to do so much retarded shit due to the sheer individual skill of Fnatic.
On June 17 2016 07:52 Hider wrote: I feel like Faze is a team that has under alot of people's radar, but now looks like a clear top 10 team in the world.
They have always been a top 10 team or round abouts. They just havent shown enough to go beyond that level
Now I know what I see: Mouz keeps playing on cbbl and every team knows they are completly clueless on that map. They have to learn either Nuke or Train to the fullest and start banning cobble.
On June 23 2016 07:11 amazingxkcd wrote: tomorrow is going to be fucking interesting. what wild stuff will occurs?
Mouz will tilt against Flipside. They take Mirage easy, tilt in an overtime on train and finally break appart on T side cbble. NaVi will win one map dominant over Echo Fox and the other map is gonna be 16:1X for NaVi.
On June 23 2016 07:11 amazingxkcd wrote: tomorrow is going to be fucking interesting. what wild stuff will occurs?
Mouz will tilt against Flipside. They take Mirage easy, tilt in an overtime on train and finally break appart on T side cbble. NaVi will win one map dominant over Echo Fox and the other map is gonna be 16:1X for NaVi.
Kinda sad seeing a team supporting an iconic brand like complexity getting rekt like that on the first map. Cobble looks a bit better but not entirely encouraging.
On June 29 2016 03:48 Rebs wrote: You know it really baffles me how the fortunes of teams change like they do for French teams. G2 was the obvious loser last year. Like big loser.
This time last year if you told me G2 or Titan or whatever would win at Elite tournament a year later I would not have believed you.
I would have believed the LG success infact I bet on it because the signs were there and they were doing all the right things.
French teams operate like its some kind of on off switch.where the go from Le sulkers to le wun tapperz
It's indeed a switch flipped: G2 took the very hard decision of removing one of the founding members of the team and a huge name in CS, nV failed to find a solution when they needed to. It's not just about "playing bad" or "playing well" though.
@Otolia: I think your emotions speak louder than your reason
On June 29 2016 07:27 Ragnarork wrote: @Otolia: I think your emotions speak louder than your reason
Happy is painted as a heel, Devil as victim, apeX as the inconsistent face, kennyS as the emotional genius face... and nV as a whole as a heel on a revenge mission. Like WTF !?
God I don't understand why people keep sucking thorin's cock all the time. This guy is neither a top-notch analyst of the game nor is he any good at building consistent storyline when he is at the desk. And despite his numerous quality videos, he isn't even following what he preaches.
On June 29 2016 07:27 Ragnarork wrote: @Otolia: I think your emotions speak louder than your reason
Happy is painted as a heel, Devil as victim, apeX as the inconsistent face, kennyS as the emotional genius face... and nV as a whole as a heel on a revenge mission. Like WTF !?
God I don't understand why people keep sucking thorin's cock all the time. This guy is neither a top-notch analyst of the game nor is he any good at building consistent storyline when he is at the desk. And despite his numerous quality videos, he isn't even following what he preaches.
But its true at the moment ... the only thing holding that team together right now is NBK being stable and Apex going off once in a while or Kenny goes off once in a while, Thats not a good sign.
Sometimes Devil is really really bad. He has more success with Stewie like plays than just playing regular solid counterstrike.
I can make you a montage out of just today where someone just slow peeked a corner into an angle he was holding and took him out which should literally like never happen especially when its a dry peek.
Its great that you can make big lays now and then but you still need to be solid.
The way this current Envy team operates is not greater than the sum of its parts. Not at all.
Triggered by Thorin, mad frenchie is mad and you give him exactly what he wants, he bathes in your tears and flavours his rhetoric with your salt.
On June 29 2016 07:27 Ragnarork wrote: @Otolia: I think your emotions speak louder than your reason
Happy is painted as a heel, Devil as victim, apeX as the inconsistent face, kennyS as the emotional genius face... and nV as a whole as a heel on a revenge mission. Like WTF !?
God I don't understand why people keep sucking thorin's cock all the time. This guy is neither a top-notch analyst of the game nor is he any good at building consistent storyline when he is at the desk. And despite his numerous quality videos, he isn't even following what he preaches.
But its true at the moment ... the only thing holding that team together right now is NBK being stable and Apex going off once in a while or Kenny goes off once in a while, Thats not a good sign.
Sometimes Devil is really really bad. He has more success with Stewie like plays than just playing regular solid counterstrike.
I can make you a montage out of just today where someone just slow peeked a corner into an angle he was holding and took him out which should literally like never happen especially when its a dry peek.
Its great that you can make big lays now and then but you still need to be solid.
The way this current Envy team operates is not greater than the sum of its parts. Not at all.
Triggered by Thorin, mad frenchie is mad and you give him exactly what he wants, he bathes in your tears and flavours his rhetoric with your salt.
I agree but I see another big problem within EnVyUs - they haven't bound as a team. As far as I can tell Happy really dislikes Devil and gives him a super hard time, thus, making it even harder for him to step up.
On June 29 2016 07:27 Ragnarork wrote: @Otolia: I think your emotions speak louder than your reason
Happy is painted as a heel, Devil as victim, apeX as the inconsistent face, kennyS as the emotional genius face... and nV as a whole as a heel on a revenge mission. Like WTF !?
God I don't understand why people keep sucking thorin's cock all the time. This guy is neither a top-notch analyst of the game nor is he any good at building consistent storyline when he is at the desk. And despite his numerous quality videos, he isn't even following what he preaches.
But its true at the moment ... the only thing holding that team together right now is NBK being stable and Apex going off once in a while or Kenny goes off once in a while, Thats not a good sign.
Sometimes Devil is really really bad. He has more success with Stewie like plays than just playing regular solid counterstrike.
I can make you a montage out of just today where someone just slow peeked a corner into an angle he was holding and took him out which should literally like never happen especially when its a dry peek.
Its great that you can make big lays now and then but you still need to be solid.
The way this current Envy team operates is not greater than the sum of its parts. Not at all.
Triggered by Thorin, mad frenchie is mad and you give him exactly what he wants, he bathes in your tears and flavours his rhetoric with your salt.
And how is that related to what I said about storylines ?
Did God made you vain Rebs ? Or are you just stupid ?
They have a huge, huge mental issue, just look at kennyS between rounds on the eleague broadcast. They lose a round, he seems crushed.
And yes, Otolia, I understand the feeling, but that was valid in 2015 (and Thorin paid champagne to them because of that). Sadly this is not the case anymore as EnVy just doesn't work as they used to. Then, Thorin baits a lot, you're biting super hard. Just stop giving a fuck about him, mute him, and it'll already be better.
People love Thorin because he looks super confident and is not afraid of bashing players, even for fun. The issue is that when he bashes for fun, people understand it as if it was super serious and think he's doing it for a reason (while in fact he just can't refrain himself from trying to make jokes all the time, which is the worse part of him imho).
On June 29 2016 07:27 Ragnarork wrote: @Otolia: I think your emotions speak louder than your reason
Happy is painted as a heel, Devil as victim, apeX as the inconsistent face, kennyS as the emotional genius face... and nV as a whole as a heel on a revenge mission. Like WTF !?
God I don't understand why people keep sucking thorin's cock all the time. This guy is neither a top-notch analyst of the game nor is he any good at building consistent storyline when he is at the desk. And despite his numerous quality videos, he isn't even following what he preaches.
But its true at the moment ... the only thing holding that team together right now is NBK being stable and Apex going off once in a while or Kenny goes off once in a while, Thats not a good sign.
Sometimes Devil is really really bad. He has more success with Stewie like plays than just playing regular solid counterstrike.
I can make you a montage out of just today where someone just slow peeked a corner into an angle he was holding and took him out which should literally like never happen especially when its a dry peek.
Its great that you can make big lays now and then but you still need to be solid.
The way this current Envy team operates is not greater than the sum of its parts. Not at all.
Triggered by Thorin, mad frenchie is mad and you give him exactly what he wants, he bathes in your tears and flavours his rhetoric with your salt.
And how is that related to what I said about storylines ?
Did God made you vain Rebs ? Or are you just stupid ?
Oh im sorry, Did I ignore your little comment about story lines and just address the part where you were critical of someone criticizing Envy somewhat justifiably, if indeed exaggerated
How very vain of me. I will in the future always address every single point you make as God has indeed made me stupid to not address every single line that the great Otolia has graced this forum with. I will take great care to make sure that every single point you make has my undivided attention and that I will furnish my responses to ensure that no less than every 10 world string is address properly.
Also his storyline is pretty consistent with how teams tend to be doing. Thats what he does. Its his style always has been. Doesnt mean he doesnt have meaningful things to say from time to time but it also doesnt mean you get your french panties in a twist everytime he criticized a french team. Because I dont see you complaining when he does it to everyone else. And you complain about consistency.
really seems like nv does better without a coach and with a motivational guy like next, might be the case when happy/nbk are indeed the leaders and they just need someone that keep them motivated and in the game.
Ex-SK is save in the last chance qualifier. If Envy wins complex tomorrow ( I just guess Gambit wins atleast 1 map against complex) and VP wins against Gambit, Ex-SK (2 man lineup) and Mouz are save in the last chance bracket If Envy or VP loses, ex-SK and the loser is in the last chance. If both lose, Envy and ex-SK are in the last chance.
On July 02 2016 18:17 Ragnarork wrote: Wow, EnVy won that?
In quite a fashion
They played like never before, no more rush a site and headshots like theres no tomorrow, much more tactical, looking for opening kills with apex/kennys, making rotations to deal with lurkers or cts making rotations, using fakes.
It was pretty awesome, seems like without maniac debil can really be the igl they need, he is even playing better than before lol
When someone from the outside wants to push his rules into esport. With valves stance on the major spots heritage, it should be clear, that spots should belong to a group of players, not orgs. But lets fully ignore, that CS:GO has no off season, that CS:GO contracts run out all over the time, that some contracts dont even go 1 year, that the orgs do not own the players... we just apply the same rules that have been applied to NHL and other american sports and that will work...
Ex-SK gets punished just for their contracts running out, how much bullshit can that be? SKs contract in LG ran out and they swaped over to SK, why punish them?
The ELEAGUE rules never define what an org is or what a "team" is. The complete scene understands under a team 5-6 people, not the organisation they play for. Or would anyone liked to see TSM instead of Astralis at the MLG Major? But ELEAGUE means that "Team" stand solely for the organisation and nothing more.
With this ruleset all CS:GO teams playing in ELEAGUE would have been forced to expand their contracts after these ran out if it would be mid ELEAGUE season. How shall that work in an esport world, where 3 years later maybe even the game isnt even played anymore? Esports is changing much faster then any conventional sport and there is no off season either, what do they expect?
Sorry, but all in all I only read "shit, we do not have an U.S.American team in the playoffs, we have to do something or our ratings will be bad. Wait, wasnt there this SK-LG thing? Nobody wants to see brasilians on TV anyway... lets kick them out, they changed their lineup, didnt they? Okay, we got C9 in, U.S. team saved, lets pick also renegades in, who most likely lose their org soon.
Yes, I am triggered and mad, how a professional League can just kick out the best team in the world because they signed a new organisation after their contracts ran out. And on top they kick another team that just did not get resigned by their org. Bullshit for me.
ELeague was originally only going to sanction Luminosity, and award its playoff spot to its players, who now compete under the SK Gaming banner.
This was prevented by a petition with signatures from the owners of seven participating organizations: Cloud9, Counter Logic Gaming, Echo Fox, NRG Esports, OpTic Gaming, Team Liquid, and Team SoloMid. The petition, a copy of which was obtained by ESPN, says that each team "in good conscience, may not be able to compete" if ELeague were to kick out Luminosity, yet leave the spot to the players, as it violates ELeague tournament entry agreement signed by each team participating in the league and the ELeague rules. Those agreements state that the spots in ELeague are owned and operated by the teams, not the players on the team
The best thing is, with their hate towards SK/ex-LG for taking their easy NA Spoils from them, they majorly fucked a small group of people known as Ex-SK. Good job TL and the rest.
Sucks but I don't see anything wrong with it. SK suddenly goes from barely 'moving on' to the top of the rankings by picking up the first place team? This is an American league on American television. Of course it makes sense that these teams feel that an org let alone a german one and member of wesa shouldnt be able to buy their spot at the top.
Also, if esports wants to avoid situations like the one that happened between LG and SK these past couple months then rules need to enforced on them by the tournaments and leagues. Same thing with valve roster locking rules for the major. If there wasn't a hardline stance in situations like this then orgs will forever do shit like poach rosters and bring in high-level ringers on a whim so why shouldn't teams competing in eleague ask that the signed agreement be enforced?
On July 07 2016 12:19 HugoBallzak wrote: Sucks but I don't see anything wrong with it. SK suddenly goes from barely 'moving on' to the top of the rankings by picking up the first place team? This is an American league on American television. Of course it makes sense that these teams feel that an org let alone a german one and member of wesa shouldnt be able to buy their spot at the top.
You do realise that these changes were not made for the sake of E-League though...? as i said CS isn't about organizations but the players and i hope it will stay so.
On July 07 2016 12:19 HugoBallzak wrote: Sucks but I don't see anything wrong with it. SK suddenly goes from barely 'moving on' to the top of the rankings by picking up the first place team? This is an American league on American television. Of course it makes sense that these teams feel that an org let alone a german one and member of wesa shouldnt be able to buy their spot at the top.
You do realise that these changes were not made for the sake of E-League though...? as i said CS isn't about organizations but the players and i hope it will stay so.
Yeah I realize that eleague was obviously neither the players or the SK org's #1 concern. That is why this happened. CS is about CS. It sure is nice to say its 'about the players' but is it really? If the players really thought so they would have formed a union by now and be sittin pretty. Fact is that all these players and orgs are cutthroat and only look out for themselves without giving second thought to the the leagues or tournaments they compete in and all the big money being thrown their way. Every single eleague team has invested time and money into their rosters and if they dont perform come tv time tough shit. Its not fair for an org to be able to shoot to the top of the rankings of a league that they already fielded a roster of 5 and shit the bed in. This is why free agency exists in real organized big money sports and that is the direction that everyone and their mother wants to take esports in. We have already seen how unprofessional this roster transfer between LG and SK has been and I bet not a single one of them ever thought about the eleague ramifications.
On July 15 2016 08:18 Luolis wrote: Why the hell does Cutler have the AWP instead of Koosta. Goddamnit people, let Koosta have his AWP.
Poor koosta, liquid broke him and I dont see him or his image recover from it.
Now Pita is awping, because cutler sucks with it, but still koosta is 2nd on top of the scoreboard of CLG... I guess they just want to leave as soon as possible, rather today then tomorrow.
EnvyUs had the bestresults in the pools, they should then go against the worst team in the pool (Mouz) but no, they go against the second best in Fnatic !!!
Reis was a good agent when he was still in SC2 but he is just terrible as a commissioner. What a shame!
I'm late to the party but I pretty much stopped watching this when SK got disqualified. What's the interest in watching a tourney where the best team got DQ'd on a technicality?
On July 18 2016 09:16 Faruko wrote: i dont know ? maybe to watch some csgo ?
"Some csgo" hm. I can watch some csgo anytime. There's Joshog and Summit. Right now there's some csgo. Selfless vs. C9. The result doesn't matter, it was just some csgo. It's pretty bad in comparison to good csgo (not to be confused with some csgo). SK plays some good csgo.
Edit: Now that I got the sass out of my system, what I meant to say was that it's a shame for the tournament as a whole, still understand why people would watch individual games but meh. The integrity of the whole thing is very much put into question with this BS.
On July 16 2016 17:29 Otolia wrote: How the fuck was the bracket drawn ?
EnvyUs had the bestresults in the pools, they should then go against the worst team in the pool (Mouz) but no, they go against the second best in Fnatic !!!
Reis was a good agent when he was still in SC2 but he is just terrible as a commissioner. What a shame!
Both the LCQ and the Playoffs bracket are drawn randomly
You can disagree with E-League's choices but at least attempt to inform yourself about them before spewing things on a forum about how much they ruined their league.
The decision to disqualify SK and ex-SK from the league is one that they say was going to happen regardless, but one that also included some political machinations by some team owners to protect the idea that the spot belonged to the organization and not the players. That may sound strange to people in esports but it's the way a lot of other sports leagues are run and Turner Sports intentionally set up E-League in this way.
To criticize the commissioner of the league for following the rules set forth in its creation goes against the very idea of a commissioner. Similarly, to call into question the integrity of the league itself for, again, following its own guidelines borders on intellectual dishonesty. No, SK will not play in E-League, and it was the correct decision. No matter an organization's intent in making a roster move, it's bad for the future of the league if a precedent is set that allows an organization to buy their way into a better spot within the league.
There is certainly an argument to be had about if it's good for the game as a whole to use this model, and I may even entertain it myself, but pointlessly rambling on about the decision as if it completely ruins the competition is a bit of a stretch.
On July 16 2016 17:29 Otolia wrote: How the fuck was the bracket drawn ?
EnvyUs had the bestresults in the pools, they should then go against the worst team in the pool (Mouz) but no, they go against the second best in Fnatic !!!
Reis was a good agent when he was still in SC2 but he is just terrible as a commissioner. What a shame!
Both the LCQ and the Playoffs bracket are drawn randomly
I realize that. It was more of a comment of the poor system in place.
On July 19 2016 12:58 yamato77 wrote: You can disagree with E-League's choices but at least attempt to inform yourself about them before spewing things on a forum about how much they ruined their league.
The decision to disqualify SK and ex-SK from the league is one that they say was going to happen regardless, but one that also included some political machinations by some team owners to protect the idea that the spot belonged to the organization and not the players. That may sound strange to people in esports but it's the way a lot of other sports leagues are run and Turner Sports intentionally set up E-League in this way.
To criticize the commissioner of the league for following the rules set forth in its creation goes against the very idea of a commissioner. Similarly, to call into question the integrity of the league itself for, again, following its own guidelines borders on intellectual dishonesty. No, SK will not play in E-League, and it was the correct decision. No matter an organization's intent in making a roster move, it's bad for the future of the league if a precedent is set that allows an organization to buy their way into a better spot within the league.
There is certainly an argument to be had about if it's good for the game as a whole to use this model, and I may even entertain it myself, but pointlessly rambling on about the decision as if it completely ruins the competition is a bit of a stretch.
I was writing a post about how I was very annoyed that you'd tell me to "at least attempt to inform myself" (which is absurd) before spewing (stop being an asshole yamato77), and that you questioned my intellectual honesty, and at the end you said something about pointless rambling because I wrote a couple of lines. It felt unjustified and unnecessarily aggressive toward me.
Then it struck me that part of why you're being unpleasant actually stems at least partially from a misunderstanding. Most of my concern was about SK not playing because SK was the favorite to win the whole tournament. When I said "The integrity of the whole thing is very much put into question with this BS.", I didn't mean that I thought Turner was corrupt somehow, it was just poorly worded. I meant that the results of the tournament ultimately will be colored by that. This was SK's tournament to lose, and we'll never know if SK would've taken it or not. Who would've beat them? Would they have taken 2 majors + Eleague in a row? It breaks the storyline and reduces the value of the tournament in a sense.
As for the politics, you're correct, I was not aware because I'm a casual viewer and I was only here to write a couple of lines, didn't intend to delve in the politics of it. If I were to comment now with limited info, I'd only say it's unfortunate that this happened, and although the commissioner probably followed the rules, it seems like in this case the rules kind of failed to result in the most desirable outcome. Can't blame the commissioner for that but either way it's a shame that the org swap resulted in this.
Anyway, I can appreciate that you think you're awesome. Good job you. I'm sorry I was wildly controversial. What the fuck even. I used to appreciate this forum for CSGO content because it didn't have the irritating people you get on HLTV and these other communities. RIP.
So many "misunderstandings", I wonder when the common denominator becomes apparent.
Also for all the aggression that people show you, Ive never once seen anyone insult you, but you seem to have no problem doing it, especially after occupying some false moral high ground. Anyway dont want to bait you anything, just some sincere non aggressive observation. I hope there is no misunderstanding regarding this.
As for E-league, I guess its pertinant to point out Thorin here because he summarized in this case anyway, quite reasonably.
It hurts that SK are not playing but the appropriate precendent has been set.
On July 20 2016 14:02 Djzapz wrote: Anyway, I can appreciate that you think you're awesme. Good job you. I'm sorry I was wildly controversial. What the fuck even. I used to appreciate this forum for CSGO content because it didn't have the irritating people you get on HLTV and these other communities. RIP.
You weren't "controversial". You wrote something that resembled as a rant, was ambiguous, and potentially could be interpreted in different ways (and as yamato follows quite closely what you call the "politics", that's not surprising he actually addressed that part).
Of course, when you say it's bullshit, it's quite not a big stretch to think you actually consider this a bad decision by E-League and so on. Don't be surprised that people talk about that, and if that's not what you meant, then precise it.
And indeed, we're not on HLTV, that doesn't mean you can discredit anyone's post just because you feel irritated.
So many "misunderstandings", I wonder when the common denominator becomes apparent.
Also for all the aggression that people show you, Ive never once seen anyone insult you, but you seem to have no problem doing it, especially after occupying some false moral high ground. Anyway dont want to bait you anything, just some sincere non aggressive observation. I hope there is no misunderstanding regarding this.
As for E-league, I guess its pertinant to point out Thorin here because he summarized in this case anyway, quite reasonably.
It hurts that SK are not playing but the appropriate precendent has been set.
Maybe you're right and I don't understand the subculture of CSGO players, I frequent a lot of forums and this doesn't happen anywhere else, though. Even on the politics threads, people are generally more reasonable.
Nonetheless I watched Thorin's video yesterday before I even read Yamato's response and it was insightful.
On July 20 2016 14:02 Djzapz wrote: Anyway, I can appreciate that you think you're awesme. Good job you. I'm sorry I was wildly controversial. What the fuck even. I used to appreciate this forum for CSGO content because it didn't have the irritating people you get on HLTV and these other communities. RIP.
You weren't "controversial". You wrote something that resembled as a rant, was ambiguous, and potentially could be interpreted in different ways (and as yamato follows quite closely what you call the "politics", that's not surprising he actually addressed that part).
Of course, when you say it's bullshit, it's quite not a big stretch to think you actually consider this a bad decision by E-League and so on. Don't be surprised that people talk about that, and if that's not what you meant, then precise it.
And indeed, we're not on HLTV, that doesn't mean you can discredit anyone's post just because you feel irritated.
I didn't discredit his post, merely disliked his accusatory tone. In my area of expertise, at work when someone says something that could be construed as untrue or ignorant, I talk to them. I don't get passive aggressive. For what it's worth I agree with the content of his post and I'm sorry my post was ambiguous. It was indeed a rant, though, and I think it's a very unfortunate state of affairs.
Anyway, sorry if I was overreacting. I barely have time to watch CS anymore and I find it very frustrating that essentially the potential for the best games just got wrecked over an org swap, whether it was justified or not by the rules of the tournament.
On the topic of SK.... it's stupid that players can expect to change teams and still maintain their league positions. Doesn't happen in any other sport. They should even have lost legend status for the major.
They want to get paid huge salaries, but provide absolutely nothing to the teams they play for. Stupid if you ask me.
On July 22 2016 05:17 foxmeep wrote: On the topic of SK.... it's stupid that players can expect to change teams and still maintain their league positions. Doesn't happen in any other sport. They should even have lost legend status for the major.
They want to get paid huge salaries, but provide absolutely nothing to the teams they play for. Stupid if you ask me.
On July 22 2016 05:17 foxmeep wrote: On the topic of SK.... it's stupid that players can expect to change teams and still maintain their league positions. Doesn't happen in any other sport. They should even have lost legend status for the major.
They want to get paid huge salaries, but provide absolutely nothing to the teams they play for. Stupid if you ask me.
What?
As in, they play for LG and expect to just walk away with all the achievements as theirs. When in actual fact they belong to LG, because they played for LG.
Well, LG was the framework, but it's actually the players that went on the server and clinched the titles.
Not even considering the fact that LG didn't appear as a great org in the light of their dispute with SK.
Overall, to say the players bring nothing to the team is quite wrong. They bring everything. An org doesn't exist in a game without players. Players can still exist without an org.
That's exactly why the seeds for the major go to player cores, and not to orgs, which I think is a good thing. And the fact it works differently in traditional sports is clearly not an argument that's going to convince me. Trying to look like traditional sports is wrong on many accounts. This one is debatable, but I feel it's the same.
On July 22 2016 05:17 foxmeep wrote: On the topic of SK.... it's stupid that players can expect to change teams and still maintain their league positions. Doesn't happen in any other sport. They should even have lost legend status for the major.
They want to get paid huge salaries, but provide absolutely nothing to the teams they play for. Stupid if you ask me.
They wont lose legend status because in Valves system the spot belongs to the players 3 out 5 rule. Its not about what should be wrong or right. Its what the rules are.
Additionally E-league is an ongoing tournament so an org change while the league is ongoing is obviously wrong. So they lost their spot. That they made a hoopla out of it was stupid of the SK players but you will notice that after someone probably explained it to them while they probably werent happy,they did shutup about it.
However changing orgs between majors doesnt seem like a big issue to me. Even the traditional sports argument would align with changing orgs as not being really a problem between events.
Also your reaction is rather severe. Generally its always players that have been severely shafted by the organizations. But it doesnt seem like you are to versed on the history of esports. CS in particular ...
And its not like these players are not providing nothing to the organizations they are playing for. They are winning.. lol. What do you want them to do ? Do a naked dance and sacrifice a goat to their orgs every week for their "fat salaries"?
Btw for LG was like piss minimum wage money without having to pay rent. If you offered them the living conditions they had to someone from the West they wouldve been like "fuck off."
So yes players do some dumb shit, its a maturing thing for everyone and not everyone has the mentorship or maturity that you should have.
They're competing for titles, that would bring prestige to the name of the org. Some of them are bringing hype and exposure (snarky people could point at Cloud9 for that heh). Etc.
I wouldn't think G2 would have sold their lineup for such a high fee if they "brought nothing to the teams".
On July 22 2016 05:32 Ragnarork wrote: Well, LG was the framework, but it's actually the players that went on the server and clinched the titles.
Not even considering the fact that LG didn't appear as a great org in the light of their dispute with SK.
Overall, to say the players bring nothing to the team is quite wrong. They bring everything. An org doesn't exist in a game without players. Players can still exist without an org.
That's exactly why the seeds for the major go to player cores, and not to orgs, which I think is a good thing. And the fact it works differently in traditional sports is clearly not an argument that's going to convince me. Trying to look like traditional sports is wrong on many accounts. This one is debatable, but I feel it's the same.
But what if four of LG went to SK, and one guy stayed?
Or three and two?
I get that player core is great for viewers, but from a business perspective it makes no sense.
And that's the whole reason for the LG/SK mess. Because instead of properly acquiring the roster and their league positions from LG, they simply tried to poach the players.
On July 22 2016 05:32 Ragnarork wrote: Well, LG was the framework, but it's actually the players that went on the server and clinched the titles.
Not even considering the fact that LG didn't appear as a great org in the light of their dispute with SK.
Overall, to say the players bring nothing to the team is quite wrong. They bring everything. An org doesn't exist in a game without players. Players can still exist without an org.
That's exactly why the seeds for the major go to player cores, and not to orgs, which I think is a good thing. And the fact it works differently in traditional sports is clearly not an argument that's going to convince me. Trying to look like traditional sports is wrong on many accounts. This one is debatable, but I feel it's the same.
But what if four of LG went to SK, and one guy stayed?
Or three and two?
I get that player core is great for viewers, but from a business perspective it makes no sense.
And that's the whole reason for the LG/SK mess. Because instead of properly acquiring the roster and their league positions from LG, they simply tried to poach the players.
I guess what we all can take from that SK case is that CLEAR rules are most important.
On July 22 2016 05:32 Ragnarork wrote: Well, LG was the framework, but it's actually the players that went on the server and clinched the titles.
Not even considering the fact that LG didn't appear as a great org in the light of their dispute with SK.
Overall, to say the players bring nothing to the team is quite wrong. They bring everything. An org doesn't exist in a game without players. Players can still exist without an org.
That's exactly why the seeds for the major go to player cores, and not to orgs, which I think is a good thing. And the fact it works differently in traditional sports is clearly not an argument that's going to convince me. Trying to look like traditional sports is wrong on many accounts. This one is debatable, but I feel it's the same.
But what if four of LG went to SK, and one guy stayed?
Or three and two?
I get that player core is great for viewers, but from a business perspective it makes no sense.
And that's the whole reason for the LG/SK mess. Because instead of properly acquiring the roster and their league positions from LG, they simply tried to poach the players.
Then the 3 players hold the spot. End of story.
And again I dont think you have any idea about the details of the situation which is why you seem to have just made assumptions and decided where you stand. Unfortunately for you I cba to explain it. Maybe someone else will.
Also there is so much wrong with the business perspective line its giving me a headache just thinking about it, so I will stop doing so.
On July 22 2016 05:32 Ragnarork wrote: Well, LG was the framework, but it's actually the players that went on the server and clinched the titles.
Not even considering the fact that LG didn't appear as a great org in the light of their dispute with SK.
Overall, to say the players bring nothing to the team is quite wrong. They bring everything. An org doesn't exist in a game without players. Players can still exist without an org.
That's exactly why the seeds for the major go to player cores, and not to orgs, which I think is a good thing. And the fact it works differently in traditional sports is clearly not an argument that's going to convince me. Trying to look like traditional sports is wrong on many accounts. This one is debatable, but I feel it's the same.
But what if four of LG went to SK, and one guy stayed?
Or three and two?
I get that player core is great for viewers, but from a business perspective it makes no sense.
And that's the whole reason for the LG/SK mess. Because instead of properly acquiring the roster and their league positions from LG, they simply tried to poach the players.
I guess what we all can take from that SK case is that CLEAR rules are most important.
The rules were clear. The drama has been generated for pretty much no reason except for the fact that the SK players and fans were upset.
Lots of small mistakes in that last map. Stewie also showed some inexperience, I remember he lost an advantaged round by peeking unnecessarily.
C9 looked much better than I expected, though. I disagree with some Twitter analysis, I don't think they were necessarily the more skilled line-up, but I do think they were benefiting from Shroud playing far above his usual level.
On July 22 2016 09:56 yamato77 wrote: Lots of small mistakes in that last map. Stewie also showed some inexperience, I remember he lost an advantaged round by peeking unnecessarily.
C9 looked much better than I expected, though. I disagree with some Twitter analysis, I don't think they were necessarily the more skilled line-up, but I do think they were benefiting from Shroud playing far above his usual level.
yeah cant disagree with that Shroud was lights out, but the thing is if he is having lights out games (and he was way above his level for the entire series) then those are series you should win against a team like Na'vi otherwise you are just not upto snuff.
Honestly Stewies small mistakes kinda balance out with the playmaking ability. I dont thnk its going to get much better or worse. Maybe with experience there will be some uptick in the mistake to big play ratio but by and large thats the kind of player he is and Im kinda ok with that.
What they really lack is that Ska is as usual basically just a boss turret and thats it. That is the next evolution for them because Nothing has been playing really well recently and thats a big bonus.
All in all I was quite impressed. Na'vi havent looked in top shape but they grind as well as the best of them and that pulled it through for them today.
On July 23 2016 07:38 Ragnarork wrote: The "easiest" match to predict of the four quarters. Welp, and it looks like it won't be a walk in the park for Astralis at least.
D2 is like the only map that you can actually bet money on Mouz players supporting Niko.
I wanted to watch virtus pro vs mouz but after i noticed that the crowd won't shut up with their nonsensical "woo" EVER i am not so sure about that anymore. There is crowd interaction which adds to the experience and then there is what happened this match... Not enjoyable to watch
On July 30 2016 08:09 The_Red_Viper wrote: I wanted to watch virtus pro vs mouz but after i noticed that the crowd won't shut up with their nonsensical "woo" EVER i am not so sure about that anymore. There is crowd interaction which adds to the experience and then there is what happened this match... Not enjoyable to watch
nvm all these annoying people surely have to be in bed at 10 pm, should be save to watch it
On July 30 2016 09:18 amazingxkcd wrote: ah another one of those europeans getting triggered by NA crowd times
I really don't care if it's EU or NA. But shouting "woooo" every few seconds in the highest frequency possible doesn't make for a good viewing experience especially when you barely can hear the commentators anymore because of that. So don't make this into an NA vs EU argument. Not every crowd is the same, this one at eleague is fucking horrible and annoying though.
Niko not showing up, that's not the lvl of play you would expect of "the best player in the world". Skill wise he surely is up there but that's not enough.
On July 30 2016 09:18 amazingxkcd wrote: ah another one of those europeans getting triggered by NA crowd times
I really don't care if it's EU or NA. But shouting "woooo" every few seconds in the highest frequency possible doesn't make for a good viewing experience especially when you barely can hear the commentators anymore because of that. So don't make this into an NA vs EU argument. Not every crowd is the same, this one at eleague is fucking horrible and annoying though.
Shutup and smell the freedom. NA crowds gonna make America great again. Lousy European..
Ugh the moment i saw there were only 2 maps played & uploaded on Youtube in NaVi vs Fnatic i knew who won. Cobble just gets worse and worse every time i see NaVi play it T_T
Did anyone actually think fnatic was gonna win this? Fnatic have not shown any good stuff since pronax. This rooster is completely in the slump and got real lucky with their groups of late. That they won over navi is their only showings (have they even won over fnatic past few years?).
VP showed up real strong in the major (SK game), gave us the "real" final. Fnatic lost versus TL even though they had the upperhand of 4 pistols.
On July 31 2016 23:29 crappen wrote: Did anyone actually think fnatic was gonna win this? Fnatic have not shown any good stuff since pronax. This rooster is completely in the slump and got real lucky with their groups of late. That they won over navi is their only showings (have they even won over fnatic past few years?).
VP showed up real strong in the major (SK game), gave us the "real" final. Fnatic lost versus TL even though they had the upperhand of 4 pistols.
For me VP were underdogs, especially after the friday's match fnatic vs na'vi, where na'vi were absolutely destroyed and outclassed.
On July 31 2016 23:29 crappen wrote: Did anyone actually think fnatic was gonna win this? Fnatic have not shown any good stuff since pronax. This rooster is completely in the slump and got real lucky with their groups of late. That they won over navi is their only showings (have they even won over fnatic past few years?).
VP showed up real strong in the major (SK game), gave us the "real" final. Fnatic lost versus TL even though they had the upperhand of 4 pistols.
Since Pronax? Did you miss the part where they won all the tournaments they entered right after, up until MLG Columbus (which was one of the first tournaments where Olof's injury impacted).
To me, this finals was going to be close, up until the maps were drawn. In fact, VP and them have quite a similar map pool, but VP prevailed and Olof was nowhere near what he can usually do. So yes, on paper, this wasn't "lol ez for VP". Then, with these maps, and an absent Olof, then you can draw conclusions afterwards.
If there's one big criticism to direct towards Fnatic, it's their permaban of Nuke. They were a really strong Inferno team. If they want to stay on top, they _must_ replace Inferno in their map pool, because right now, they let it get shallower and that's not how you dominate CS.
On July 31 2016 23:29 crappen wrote: Did anyone actually think fnatic was gonna win this? Fnatic have not shown any good stuff since pronax. This rooster is completely in the slump and got real lucky with their groups of late. That they won over navi is their only showings (have they even won over fnatic past few years?).
VP showed up real strong in the major (SK game), gave us the "real" final. Fnatic lost versus TL even though they had the upperhand of 4 pistols.
Since Pronax? Did you miss the part where they won all the tournaments they entered right after, up until MLG Columbus (which was one of the first tournaments where Olof's injury impacted).
To me, this finals was going to be close, up until the maps were drawn. In fact, VP and them have quite a similar map pool, but VP prevailed and Olof was nowhere near what he can usually do. So yes, on paper, this wasn't "lol ez for VP". Then, with these maps, and an absent Olof, then you can draw conclusions afterwards.
If there's one big criticism to direct towards Fnatic, it's their permaban of Nuke. They were a really strong Inferno team. If they want to stay on top, they _must_ replace Inferno in their map pool, because right now, they let it get shallower and that's not how you dominate CS.
Yeah lol @ Fnatic haven't shown anything since. Props for your attempt at combating ignorance.
So glad that if SK wasnt there that VP won. They are so mercurial is frustratingly amazing.
On July 31 2016 10:59 Kuroeeah wrote: i love vp but the finals was kinda boring . still happy i guess
What? That was some pretty impressive CS by VP.
He meant fnatic wasnt worth opponent and we got easy fast rape 2-0. Fnatic won just 1 (sic!) round as CT! It was pathetic. The worst final performance ever. So bad SK got banned and we got robbed from epic SK - VP final. Fnatic got double "lucky", not only SK got banned but also Navi is doomed with internal problems now. Normally they should be out in quarters.
Or it was boring because it was 10th time VP won a major tournament...
For anyone who has a clue about CS it was obvious Fnatic will never win anything when Pronax left. About VP it was also obvious they will win a major again. This is their cycle: work hard>win a major> long vacation> slump> working hard > win a major > vacation> etc. They have been like this since ~2008.
On July 31 2016 10:59 Kuroeeah wrote: i love vp but the finals was kinda boring . still happy i guess
What? That was some pretty impressive CS by VP.
He meant fnatic wasnt worth opponent and we got easy fast rape 2-0. Fnatic won just 1 (sic!) round as CT! It was pathetic. The worst final performance ever. So bad SK got banned and we got robbed from epic SK - VP final. Fnatic got double "lucky", not only SK got banned but also Navi is doomed with internal problems now. Normally they should be out in quarters.
Or it was boring because it was 10th time VP won a major tournament...
For anyone who has a clue about CS it was obvious Fnatic will never win anything when Pronax left. About VP it was also obvious they will win a major again. This is their cycle: work hard>win a major> long vacation> slump> working hard > win a major > vacation> etc. They have been like this since ~2008.
Fnatic had a 6 tournament win streak after Pronax left, are you real
On July 31 2016 10:59 Kuroeeah wrote: i love vp but the finals was kinda boring . still happy i guess
What? That was some pretty impressive CS by VP.
He meant fnatic wasnt worth opponent and we got easy fast rape 2-0. Fnatic won just 1 (sic!) round as CT! It was pathetic. The worst final performance ever. So bad SK got banned and we got robbed from epic SK - VP final. Fnatic got double "lucky", not only SK got banned but also Navi is doomed with internal problems now. Normally they should be out in quarters.
Or it was boring because it was 10th time VP won a major tournament...
For anyone who has a clue about CS it was obvious Fnatic will never win anything when Pronax left. About VP it was also obvious they will win a major again. This is their cycle: work hard>win a major> long vacation> slump> working hard > win a major > vacation> etc. They have been like this since ~2008.
Fnatic had a 6 tournament win streak after Pronax left, are you real
He's obviously trolling, because nothing in this post makes any sense.
On July 31 2016 23:29 crappen wrote: Did anyone actually think fnatic was gonna win this? Fnatic have not shown any good stuff since pronax. This rooster is completely in the slump and got real lucky with their groups of late. That they won over navi is their only showings (have they even won over fnatic past few years?).
VP showed up real strong in the major (SK game), gave us the "real" final. Fnatic lost versus TL even though they had the upperhand of 4 pistols.
For me VP were underdogs, especially after the friday's match fnatic vs na'vi, where na'vi were absolutely destroyed and outclassed.
I felt exactly the same way but im glad VP did it.