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Braavos36362 Posts
Casy (T-OGN) VS NaDa (T-Pantech)
Casy + Show Spoiler + Casy entered this OSL knowing that it was his chance, through his two best matchups, to show his critics that he was not a one-OSL wonder. His brilliant fake FE versus July and the outstanding game 3 early rush versus FireBatHero has solidified his claim as the Neo-Emperor, the Terran player most likely to inherit Boxer's legacy and continue the Emperor's tradition of play.
Will Casy, with the Ghost of Lim Yo Hwan on his shoulder, seize the moment and breakthrough to the upper echelon of Terran players? Casy. NaDa. The first OSL Semifinal is tonight!
NaDa + Show Spoiler +NaDa stumbled into OSL brackets but has found his stride, defeating two excellent up-and-coming players in UpMagic and Yarnc in their best matchups. NaDa could retire today and nobody would doubt his legacy, yet he soldiers on. Three wins was golden, but Four would only mean only one thing: that those whispered words would be spoken loud and clear, and nobody would ever doubt him again: "The best of all time."
Will he destroy the OSL Champion's Curse much like he did Autumn's Legend last year? NaDa. Casy. The first OSL Semifinal is tonight!
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GOGO NEO EMPEROR. The cheese be with you!
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Kennigit
Canada19447 Posts
oh christ, is the finals next week im on going on reading week and will be without internet access....im not going to survive
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Braavos36362 Posts
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1... 2... 3... Han Dongwook FIGHTING!!!!!
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Belgium6733 Posts
LEE YOON YEOL 4TH OSL WIN GO!
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CA10824 Posts
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Hong Kong20321 Posts
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Go NaDa you can do this!!!. For The 4 Badges!!!.
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Nada does not deserve 4 OSLs.
Han Dongwook FIGHTING~
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On February 13 2007 15:23 MJ wrote: so its 10:30 CET ?
yup
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United States20661 Posts
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fuck this kid up nada, oh ya what exactly did casy do with the fake FE
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Nice post hot. Die Nada, GoGo Casy!
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I can see both winning it, Jeez I really don't know who has the upper hand.
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Somebody is neither sleeping tonight nor going to class tomorrow
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Osaka26966 Posts
Im skipping out on Valentines day and going to a PC cafe in order to not be disturbed.
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NaDa is a legend.
SkyintheSea, Jetaimemina, ilovesil, Sea.s2, OnePageMemories
AKA Freestyle Terran/ Tornado Terran FTW.
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Osaka26966 Posts
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thx dude, i guess he just assumed he had cc without moving the ol back to see haha
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btw, with these league games do they come with replays after or do you have to watch it live / vods ?
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Live or vods. No replays.
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Is there a reason why replays are not available? and if i do watch these vods where can i find them? do i need a password or whatever on some korean site that i dont understand or is there a place that has updated important vods.
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No replays because 1. the channels want people to watch their show and not wait for replays and 2. the progamers don't want their replays analyzed.
Vods can be found on different sites:
http://www.teamliquid.net/tracker, our own tracker. You have to have some BT client installed to download. http://www.sc2.org, the VODs will take a bit longer to be on here, and the quality is worse, but the download's extremely fast. You need to sign up to be able to download.
Youtube and Google Video also have a lot of Starcraft videos by now, if the semis are uploaded quickly, someone will probably post a link to them here.
Those are the two best for non-korean users. Yaoyuan also has all the VODs but it's extremely slow for anyone not living in asia. DCinside (korean site) also uploads VODs extremely fast, sometimes the links to the downloads there get linked by someone here.
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oh ic, thx orome for your prompt response
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gogogo casy as much as i like nada.... casy is the one to take down savior
btw in that .gif did he show 3 badges and show 4 fingers?
1300th post YEA
BTW TL.NET IS AWESOME!!!!!!!!
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that means he's goign for his 4th ....jeez
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Maps: Neo Arkanoid HitchHiker RLT Longinus 2 Neo Arkanoid
nada beat upmagic 2-1 to get here, casy 2-1 vs fbh. hmmm who's win was more decisive? i was slightly passed out watching casy vs fbh, but seems like fbh took a beating with casy's drops and build order advantage. nada's macro and always superb execution got him through upmagic's cheesy but creative builds.
arkanoid: both will go gol/tank drops - all depends on drop timing and good comsats. i think casy and nada will take one win each. hitchhiker: not sure about tvt strats here (tank defense, then go wraith? or take nat ledges), but ill give it to nada rlt: nada may cheese proxy 2rax, and casy will defend with vult, gaining advantage. didnt nada himself say he's bad on rlt? rlt goes to casy. longinus: both will do some early marine/scv/vult pushing. whoever can take/hold middle will win.
nada vs casy will be about execution - micro and build orders. the longer a game goes on, the more chance nada has to win. prediction: 3-2 nada
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Heart and soul for Casy on this one.
Lim's Legacy FTW!
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thedeadhaji
39473 Posts
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I want Casy to win :D :D :D
But I voted Nada =(
Gogo Casy!!
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I think nada will take it 3-2 or 3-1. His defense is just incredible, so Casy will have a hard time finishing the games early, and in a lategame macrowar Nada will probably outplay him.
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I think I'd rather have Nada win it and lose to Savior in the finals. Casy just isnt as exciting to me anymore.
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thedeadhaji
39473 Posts
On February 13 2007 15:19 [Carlodajin] wrote: Go NaDa you can do this!!!. For The 4 Badges!!!.
I SEE ENGLISH!! I SEE ENGLISH!!
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It's actually hard to pick one, cause they are both such awesome terrans.
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casy will fuck him up.
Or Nada will win 3-2 cuz of arkanoid.
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On February 13 2007 17:12 sC.lover wrote: that means he's goign for his 4th ....jeez
yet again proving my lack of common sense
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On February 13 2007 18:19 thedeadhaji wrote:Show nested quote +On February 13 2007 15:19 [Carlodajin] wrote: Go NaDa you can do this!!!. For The 4 Badges!!!. I SEE ENGLISH!! I SEE ENGLISH!! \
lol haji!!!!;;
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i want casy to win, i think it will be more interesting to see casy vs savior than savior vs nada =) GREAT OSL BTW~ ;D
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On February 13 2007 16:10 BalloonFight wrote: Nice post hot. Die Nada, GoGo Casy!
No Kyle noooOoOoOOOOOO!!! How could you not support Nada and me???!!!
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Casy vs Savior for OSL finals please ^^
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I BELIEVE IN THE "NOTHING" TERRAN
DE NADA!!~!
I BELIEVE IN THE "IT'S ME" TERRAN!
나다!!!~!
NADA ALL THE WAY!!!!!! WWWWW00000OOOOOOOO000000O0O0O0O0O0O0OTTTTTTT!!!!!
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I don't normally like nada but after the pimp move he did vs yellow, I have to root for him. GO nada!
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Yeah that collar pop followed by the 4 fingers was bad ass.
I really want NaDa to advance! I think NaDa will play much better then he did in super fight against savior, if they both make it to the finals, and he will prove that he is the best!
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NaDa describes what he will do to Casy in tonight's games.
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On February 13 2007 19:37 SonuvBob wrote:NaDa describes what he will do to Casy in tonight's games. But Casy is on the defensive!
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lol Well, I guess in that pic Casy wins Vote Casy people.
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I hope Nada wins, as it will be even more poignant for Savior when he rapes him in the final.
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United States20661 Posts
I think NaDa's FORCE has returned enough to fight sAviOr. I mean, before superfight, he was all like s2s2 sea.lovely happy terran waving his arms around to make <3 symbols over his head but now he's like LOL FOUR BADGES FUCK YOU terran, definitely change of image to be more badass and awesome. With this mindset he can fight savior and win, especially on these maps.
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man this shit starts so in between early and late lol... I don't know whether to stay up until then and be fucked tomorrow... or go to sleep now and wake up really early... and still be fucked tomorrow :S lol
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On February 13 2007 19:42 OctoPuSs wrote:Show nested quote +On February 13 2007 19:37 SonuvBob wrote:NaDa describes what he will do to Casy in tonight's games. But Casy is on the defensive!
My genitals are unavailable.
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I want both to win but go Casy.
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CA10824 Posts
On February 13 2007 20:20 Last Romantic wrote: ...before superfight he was all like s2s2 sea.lovely happy terran waving his arms around to make <3 symbols over his head but now he's like LOL FOUR BADGES FUCK YOU terran, definitely change of image to be more badass and awesome. .... LOL good post ^_^
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rinizim
Korea (South)187 Posts
Are you all aware that Nada has never lost a single semi bo5 in Starleague? Moreover, that he was never defeated in the Starleague finals, too?
=== Oh and this is the live report thread? right? right?
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if someone could provide a shoutcast server
i'd be more than happy to give reports of the matches over the shoutcasty thingy
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NaDa IS! the _BeSt! of all time..not only in the overall ranking. He will smash savior in the finals, if savior advances to finals!
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
circumstances circumstances. circumstantial reasons, etc etc. nada is going well right now, but let's not take his past achievements as some sort of magical aura of power now.
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Valhalla18444 Posts
On February 14 2007 00:07 Day[9] wrote: if someone could provide a shoutcast server
i'd be more than happy to give reports of the matches over the shoutcasty thingy
i can probably do this too, if there isnt enough room on one server and more people want it
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English cast? GREAT! But I also like the korean one^_^!!
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On February 13 2007 23:58 rinizim wrote:Are you all aware that Nada has never lost a single semi bo5 in Starleague? Moreover, that he was never defeated in the Starleague finals, too? === Oh and this is the live report thread? right? right?
There is always a start
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Oooh im so excited, this is gonna be great! Rooting for Casy!
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CASY PLZ BE MY VALENTINE TODAY!! =@
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On February 14 2007 00:57 ram wrote: CASY PLZ BE MY VALENTINE TODAY!! =@
Gay? T.T
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Grubby vs Moon on MBC > bo5 TvT, even if it is Casy and NaDa. Sorry...
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On February 14 2007 01:06 Nesseman wrote:Grubby vs Moon on MBC > bo5 TvT, even if it is Casy and NaDa. Sorry... Dude, you are in the wrong forum:-))
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On February 14 2007 01:06 Nesseman wrote:Grubby vs Moon on MBC > bo5 TvT, even if it is Casy and NaDa. Sorry...
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im hoping for some aggressive tvt and not some chesslike tvt
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NaDa will be defending expoing and macroing like hell Casy is going to be the aggressor.. thats what i think
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starts in 2 minutes right?
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On February 14 2007 01:28 mdb wrote: starts in 2 minutes right? yes, but the talking part...the games 20 minutes later
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On February 14 2007 01:03 G.s)NarutO wrote:Gay? T.T
gay for casy only (sorry Mora) =P
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ROFL NADA!! ahhhh TOO CRAZY!
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Alright they're introducing players now, should be starting soon
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casy's assistant >> nada's assistant! casy 1-0 nada
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I can't see the links to the actual streams on sc2.org, where they used to be it's just a grey bar now. Anyone have any idea as to how i can watch them on here? Both the other links to the ogn site don't work for me either.
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Casy last ten games 8-2 TvT. Nada same 8-2.
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On February 13 2007 20:20 Last Romantic wrote: I think NaDa's FORCE has returned enough to fight sAviOr. I mean, before superfight, he was all like s2s2 sea.lovely happy terran waving his arms around to make <3 symbols over his head but now he's like LOL FOUR BADGES FUCK YOU terran, definitely change of image to be more badass and awesome. With this mindset he can fight savior and win, especially on these maps.
wow he just did a "bang" thing with his finger before entering the booth making both the crowd and the commentators go wild
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On February 14 2007 01:40 [Toss]adar wrote: I can't see the links to the actual streams on sc2.org, where they used to be it's just a grey bar now. Anyone have any idea as to how i can watch them on here? Both the other links to the ogn site don't work for me either. http://www.playsc.com/live/
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On February 14 2007 01:40 [Toss]adar wrote: I can't see the links to the actual streams on sc2.org, where they used to be it's just a grey bar now. Anyone have any idea as to how i can watch them on here? Both the other links to the ogn site don't work for me either.
Try logging in to the site and/ore using IE
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God i'm excited. Please let it be 3-2 Casy.
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5 games would be damn nice
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CASY PRAID
rofl = )
still rooting for NaDa
gogogogo
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Game starting. Casy bottom right. Nada bottom left. Arkanoid.
Casy purple, Nada teal.
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game starting and who is who ? ididnt pay attention tt
?! :D
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On February 14 2007 01:41 M2 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 01:40 [Toss]adar wrote: I can't see the links to the actual streams on sc2.org, where they used to be it's just a grey bar now. Anyone have any idea as to how i can watch them on here? Both the other links to the ogn site don't work for me either. http://www.playsc.com/live/
Thank you that stream works for me.
On February 14 2007 01:42 -MrC- wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 01:40 [Toss]adar wrote: I can't see the links to the actual streams on sc2.org, where they used to be it's just a grey bar now. Anyone have any idea as to how i can watch them on here? Both the other links to the ogn site don't work for me either. Try logging in to the site and/ore using IE
I did both the first time around, usually i have to click on the big sc2.org logo at the top to get them to show up but for some reason this time they didn't. Whatever I can watch I'm happy.
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how is 2 rax working on arkanoid wtf nada ? D:
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2 rax m&m rush vs fast cc ?? well.. lol.. o.O !? :D
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i cannot login people, lovecats or PoP please help me!
something seriously fucked up?
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NaDa killing neutral building Casy going fast cc nada seems to play marine all in game lol :D
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nada had too much cheese for breakfast? O.Oa
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fac starting for casy no rine for casy nada 8 rines now
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Stream lagging so bad.
Nada 2 rax vs. 14 cc Casy should be interesting.
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i doubt nadas timing is good enough
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scouting rax sees nadas rines !!
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WTF NAda just killed casy with perfect timing and a 2 rax rush with 10 rines 2 medics wtf !? im stunned.. amazing play.. would have never ever expected this.. and casy looks like : WTF
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that was awesome... nada must've experimented to send exactly two scvs to attack the first neutral building to get the timing right
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Braavos36362 Posts
how the fuck did he know where he was what a hacker lol
GO NADA
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nada got lucky cause of the close positions -.-
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On February 14 2007 01:52 Hot_Bid wrote: how the fuck did he know where he was what a hacker lol
GO NADA This is what I'm wondering. Is there something I'm missing or was it a lucky guess?
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Braavos36362 Posts
On February 14 2007 01:52 greatmeh wrote: nada got lucky cause of the close positions -.- its not that much closer than any of the other positions, its the same amount of neutral buildings
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I think I really hate nada now >_<
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that was a gamble on positions
chance: 1/3 to win straight
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it was a lucky guess nothing more
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he saw the rax of casy with his scv !! wow that timing was so unreal.. and casy had no chance at all beating that strat.. and who told me NaDa has no strategic skills !? lol D:
wtf.. ^^
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Netherlands19124 Posts
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He saw the barrack with scv
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He saw the rax with the scv, so he knew where he was ? nothing lucky about that tbh..T_T
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On February 14 2007 01:54 MaGic~PhiL wrote: He saw the rax with the scv, so he knew where he was ? nothing lucky about that tbh..T_T
he was on the right way so..
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damn i was stuck in a game of sc so i missed the first match, glad it was quick and not some epic shit i wouldnt wanna miss
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Lol if boxer did that he'd be a freak of nature, but with nada it's luck -____-; That was just amazing. awesome timing
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wtf casy was supposed to cheese gg nada
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still the timing.. sooo unreal.. so.. i dunno casy simply had no chance at all with this strat he had nothing at all to defend it.. even if the positions had been different and nada needed more time casy would probably not have any chance, either.. like 2 vults wouldnt have saved him
im just stunned about the timing and the perfect counter strat of nada.. it was almost perfect T_T poor casy looked like he got stroke by a lightning D:
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so much for boring macro terran -_-
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they showed the replay.. and exactly proved me right.. scv saw it and casy was 99% clueless ^^ wow :D
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hottie tech girl in nadas booth WOOT
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some people will still discredit nada forever.. its just lame.. some peole will never accept how good he is until they realize.. that its their own bias and has nothing to do with the truth
NaDa's play has become a lot more viable latley and hes by for no macro only player anymore.. his games very very viable nowadays..
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You don't play experienced Pros like Nada and get away with predictable openings build orders.
That map they always cheese with rax or you go fast CC. That was a sure thing basically for Nada. Very well prepared.
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Sweden1225 Posts
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New game on hitchhiker.
Casy green top.
Nada blue bottom.
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game 2 starting on hitchhiker...
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy playing under a `SlaYerS` nick, awsome :p
(or did I misread sparkyz)
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sc2.org works for me on IE
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Casy playing under name SparkyZ AdamaS
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arkanoid has some amount of luck for the build orders in tvt, just like the usual case in zvz
casy's play was very reasonable i think, but nada 's build was great and he got kinda lucky with seeing casy's rax
good to see nada being able to mix it up though
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Both players starting standard this game. Looks like we'll end up with a better game than last one
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NaDa scouts fas cc of casy
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Quick cc for Casy and starport.
Nada with 7 rines a fac with addon and upgrading.
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Blue spots greens attempt to hide his expansion cc, green starts a port didnt have machine shop yet.
Blue grading from shop. (whos who?)
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Netherlands19124 Posts
ah k casy = green
Nada moving out with 1 tank with siege and 8 rines
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Nada moving out with one tank + the rines.
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blue's nada
haha he seems to be doing an FD build, 1 tank 7 rines then 1 vul coming up after
scouted by casy's floating rax
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wow nadas simply building all rines.. like 8 ok nada simply owns...
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Nada doing serious SCV damage as vults with mines mine up casy's fac.
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Nada gaining Casys ramp and is taking down scvs by the boatload, mining up in casys base in front of his fact. This is a spanking -.-
Nice choice on the mines instead of siege first.
Nada exping @ nat.
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the game is still pretty open.. nada did an attack which didnt fail but he didnt succed either.. wraith harrasing nada
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Nada adding armory, casy stuck with mines in his base.
Nada adding at least 1 more fact that I can see and finishis his exp.
Casy harassing some with 2 paper planes and scores some scv kills.
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goilath coming and kill 1 wraith one still survived
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Gollies out for nada but casy cloacks and continues harass.
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Nada way in the lead. Casy tried some harass with cloak wraiths but scanner is up and he only got a few scv kills to the lots Nada got on his attack.
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Nada moving out with tank/gol now.
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ok nada is clearly in the lead he won that 99% imho he has good eco and a expo and 2 tanks and.. casy has nothing..
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Nada adding Starport addon for drop presumably and moves out with 2 tanks and 4 gollies towards casys natural.
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Nada still had his barracks there to spot for highground.
2 tanks and a vult there to defend but casys miscontrolls or somthing and nada gains the ramp again and is again defending with scvs.
Scvs make a nice surround and finish the last 2 gollies as tank reinforcements pop out.
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Nada got up Casy's ramp again but scvs pulled save the day. Just mining time lost there.
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NaDa is clearly leading rax is denying casy from expoing
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Lol nice. nada lands his rax in Casy's nat just as it was trying to land and stops it.
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy just now adds a 2nd fact as nada adds 2 more for a total count of 4.
Nada has a nice standing army,
HAHAHA
Nada lands his barracks like 0.5 seconds before casy can land his natural CC and prevents him from exping there for a sec or 20.
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NaDa just rapes casy now.. as if casy was a chobo wow cant believe it
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Nada finishing the game, dropping goliaths while sieging right outside casys nat / ramp.
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Nada ignoring the exp CC and goes in the main and kills the rest of the scvs.
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Casy about to GG. Nada attacks again and Casy has nothing.
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oh my god nadas micro is good and casy should just leave now
NaDa's stratgies were better 2 X times
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Nada sieges up with 3 tanks outside casys facts whos got like 12 scvs left total, and nada with dropship reinforcements on the way.
Siege tanks in range of facts = gg no chance instagibbed reinforcements.
Nada RAPES with early game control vs greedy play from Casy twice now.
GGed~
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to all the haters:now u see..nada is for real
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how can i watch the live = ='' any link?
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Nada once again outplays Casy like crazy early game. Very nice tank+7 rine + mine vult rush vs. fast cc from Casy.
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nada is DISMANTLING casy <3
i knew it, GENIUS TERRAN FIGHTING
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wow
what player other than nada would think to go 7 marine + tank + vulturemine rush vs that fast CC by Casy
great great great play by nada.
wow hahahah
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Seems nada watched Savior punish greedy terrans and decided that it's as needed as Boxer bringing back oldschool rushes on Arcadia II to counter the greedy macro style play.
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i dont know how these game can be so one sided.. Casy is trying to play macro game and nada just finishs him with great timing attacks in early game.. huk..
Well lets see if Casy can come back from this.. NaDa just scouted his build and played a nice fast counter strat..
still im kinda surprised.. once again nada is making it look sooo easy..
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That was quick thinking by nada to drop the goliaths on the ramp, preventing Casy's tanks from retreating.
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I ran out of cigs... And i need one badly T_T
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this is so out of character, nada's rushing both times and casy's macroing
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This one comes from SC2.org, summary of the game:
Casy went fast wraith. Nada went fast rape.
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Yeah baby, go Nada
Nada is fucking awesome. Crazy ass strategies
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Gogo Nada! Love the aggresive style go for it!
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this is just.. NaDa showing he has it all.. and Casy should try to.. well.. come back now and give is best.. he looks kinda confused and doesnt realize what happened.. these werent games that u could call close.. they were one sided.. very one sided..
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Netherlands19124 Posts
On February 14 2007 02:16 MaGic~PhiL wrote: i dont know how these game can be so one sided.. Casy is trying to play macro game and nada just finishs him with great timing attacks in early game.. huk..
Well lets see if Casy can come back from this.. NaDa just scouted his build and played a nice fast counter strat..
still im kinda surprised.. once again nada is making it look sooo easy.. Well its kinda perfect countering so it makes everything look easy then hehe. Same if you open 2 gate corsair speed zeal vs a mass muta player. Never stands a chance no matter how good they are. Just too greedy play from Casy with severely lacking scouting to take that plunge.
First game was a tad unlucky but this game he called it out over himself tbh.
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I just realised NaDa went FD Terran in TvT. Unbelievable :D!
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Osaka26966 Posts
I just bought three hours at a pc cafe to watch this and it is already 2-0? Casy better win one.
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Casy didnt scout at all the second game.
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On February 14 2007 02:20 Manifesto7 wrote: I just bought three hours at a pc cafe to watch this and it is already 2-0? Casy better win one. I hope for a quick 3-0. Then you'll have time to read your PM's .
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CA10824 Posts
btw, the first game on arkanoid they said nada scouted casy's main with his first scan.
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The second game was really well played by Nada, first time in a while that I've been truly impressed by his play.
No worries though, in TvT series, Casy always loses the first two before he starts playing for real.
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Casy's done he isn't going to come back from 0-2 to win the series
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Russian Federation1953 Posts
so far NaDa is schooling this Casy Noob
and that's right
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i doubt casy can win 3 games in a row vs nada
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Osaka26966 Posts
On February 14 2007 02:21 OctoPuSs wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 02:20 Manifesto7 wrote: I just bought three hours at a pc cafe to watch this and it is already 2-0? Casy better win one. I hope for a quick 3-0. Then you'll have time to read your PM's .
all 2600 of them? -_-
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On February 14 2007 02:23 Manifesto7 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 02:21 OctoPuSs wrote:On February 14 2007 02:20 Manifesto7 wrote: I just bought three hours at a pc cafe to watch this and it is already 2-0? Casy better win one. I hope for a quick 3-0. Then you'll have time to read your PM's . all 2600 of them? -_- You can do it!
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I hope for at least one game for casy
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Braavos36362 Posts
did you see casy's face its like a truck hit him
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Netherlands19124 Posts
If casy stops being a stubborn greedy cunt, he'll pull this to 2-2 I pray but at least drag out a game on RLT.
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On February 14 2007 02:25 Hot_Bid wrote: did you see casy's face its like a truck hit him Probably a truck full of shit. Seriously this serie confuses me. NaDa is doing what Casy should be doing and vice-versa.
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Netherlands19124 Posts
On February 14 2007 02:25 Hot_Bid wrote: did you see casy's face its like a truck hit him Only difference between him and Smurg is that it would have had to have been a truck full of shit.
Lolz~ <3
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Casy looks really shaken from losing those first 2 games so badly.
Nada looks confident he's going to finish this out with ease.
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so far im just surprised.. casy just was doomed to lose the two games.. he had far far too less information about nadas play.. and nada always knew what he was doing first game he just played the best strategy vs the strategy that everyone uses to play TvT on Arkanoid..
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... Its NaDa curse! Never losing in the bo5 series... or in the finals
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On February 11 2007 07:41 Twisted wrote: my god magic phil is so annoying when fanboying
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Someone on sc2.org is translating the commentators, and apparently, Casy accidentally canceled a tank during nada's first attack. If this is true, that really sucks. Hope Casy gets a win or two at least.
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On February 14 2007 02:25 Nyovne wrote: If casy stops being a stubborn greedy cunt, he'll pull this to 2-2 I pray but at least drag out a game on RLT.
where was he stubborn greedy ?? He played the good strats but Nada saw them and outplayed him and the so called '' good strats ''
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NaDa blue again.. he wins!^^ casy cheese.. barracks for supply (proxi)
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Game starting.
RLT
Casy Orange 12. Nada Light Blue 3.
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On February 14 2007 02:30 Orome wrote:Show nested quote +On February 11 2007 07:41 Twisted wrote: my god magic phil is so annoying when fanboying
hmm NaDa so far raped Casy
whats fanboying about that ? lol o.O
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awesome, 12v3 reverse temple... and casy's proxying 8raxing!
this tvt series is actually pretty good to watch, wow
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I think NaDa will destroy cheesing casy.. proxy rax vs nada lol
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On February 14 2007 02:30 Blind wrote: Someone on sc2.org is translating the commentators, and apparently, Casy accidentally canceled a tank during nada's first attack. If this is true, that really sucks. Hope Casy gets a win or two at least.
he cancelled to get money for wraith, no point using wraith when he's mined in^^
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Casy 8 rax between 12 and 3
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Nada will probably fend this off without any problem
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u gotta skate8152 Posts
Score so far? I just woke up
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First rine moving toward nada. His rax almost done.
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NaDa kicked marines ass .now huge advantage
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy picks the confrontation for some weird reason and loses his rines.
Nada ahead with fact.
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Casy playing for fast wraiths
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nada pulled a TON of scvs. Definitely more than he needed. But he stopped the rush.
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Nada did miss alot of mining through, took like 10+ scvs off mining for half a min.
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2-0 nada
i don't think nada has a huge advantage... his factory's probably only slightly faster. nada lost tons of mining time and a couple scvs
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The problem with todays progaming is that so many games are rush games ;( no fun, a savior legendary comeback game is expected from the finals
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nada lost a vult absolutely for no reason here.. and nada is playing fast expansion and still raping casy units ( wtf )
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NaDa kicked 2 vults + 4 marine of casy.. he wins it
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ok lol
NaDa just has an advantage once again his micro was better
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Nice rax cover over his units in his choke @ nadas exp, and casy goes in to test it.
Loses all his units, and nada counters for a really easy 3-0....
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Nada's fac is done first of course, but Casy's is right behind. I think the game is in parity.
Casy adding starport.
Nada adding cc.
Nada/Casy fight at Nada's choke. Nada wins with more rines.
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Omg Casy how could you blow it..
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy defends with a tank but nada has his expo up, armory/acad comming up, adding another fact/port and casy has nothing but 1 tank, 1 wraith and low scv count :p.
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Osaka26966 Posts
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Nada's counter after the attack was devastating. The 2 vults and 3 rines tore up a lot of scvs before a tank could come out :/
Nada huge lead now, he's going to make it 3-0.
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ok nada has nothing vs cloaked wraiths but i doubt with a 2nd cc he will lose to this..
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nada does perfect countertactics to whatever casy do, gg;(
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Gollies out vs Wraith, owned paper plane.
2x comsat as well. (wel at least in main but I presume its being added @ exp as well)
Casy moving in with wraith and 2 tanks!
Pulls back out.
Casy takes natural
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CASY TRyING a fast push now with siege tanks, soon COULD SUCCED
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy is behind on every level right now, if he had siege and would have set up shop outside nada's natural when he had a poke at it 30 sec ago he would have done major damage.
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Netherlands19124 Posts
CHaron booster upgrade done for Nadas gollies as he shows while taking down casys rax @ his natural and a random wraith in the centre of the map.
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Ok critical game state reached Casys too passive , though how does he want to win with this ?? he is just waiting and putting tanks on the map in siege mode.. Nada has the superior expo count and eco... dunno how Casy wants to ..
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why is casy trying to turn this into a macro game when he's so economically behind... he should've been in with dropships
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NaDa building a 2nd expansion at 6 natural nada has like 8 gols and 2 tanks and here they fight..
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nice casy wastes all units
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casy loses 8 tanks... to nadas force... thats pretty much gg now
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Nada adding dropships,
casy moving at nada but sieges JUST inside nadas siege range and loses 7? tanks to 1 tank and gollie from nada due to bad scouting AGAIN.
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Nada drops 2goli 1 tank behind casy's main minerals. Very successful. Nada takes the time to expand again during that attack and transfers scvs.
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I think he is way to nervous,
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Already over? Damn, the WC3 I was going to watch was delayed and is starting about now so I could have watched Casy vs Nada AND Grubby vs Moon. Serves me right I guess
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NaDa comes out on top and goes for a drop with 2 tanks at casys main did do some damage..
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This game hurts...deeply..
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casy nicely defendin drops from nada now but nada keeps on harrasing like mad
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OOOOH both droping at the same time
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Nada bigger 3 dropships drop in Casy's main while Casy drops Nada's main. I think it's over.
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Nada gollie tank dropping casys main and scoring scv kills.
Casy defends but loses a proper number of scvs before he does.
Nada now with d ships all over the place and as hes heading towards casys natural he sees casy trying to drop his main.
Deflects the attack and still goes for the attack on the natural but gets defended off by gollies.
3 ships for nada now.
Casy really seems to have lost his nerve and focus .
Nada going with 3 ships for a drop next to Casys facts as casy drops nadas main with 2 tanks and 4 gols and is taking down depots and scvs... (more dmg then he should be doing with that)
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CaSy WINS THIS !? i think so !!!
casy defended nadas main drop
nadas still losing much in his main
CASY WINS THIS now.. tt
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OMG casy somehow managed to hold his drop and defeat Nada's O_O
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YES! I CAN LIVE. I BREATHE. FUCKKKKKKKKKKKKKKk
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy now defends his main but with huge scv losses and nada still has casy in his main T_________T
Nada defends! but just then casy drops reinforcements and nada is getting pushed out of his main! loses ALOT of depots and tech.
Nada going ALL IN WITH SCVS TANKS GOLLIES DSHIPS TO DEFEND RIGHT AS CASY REINFORCES AGAIN.
Crazy battle!
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OMG perfect drop from casy, the match evens out hahahahah!
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NaDa defending with scvs casy brings a new drop and just has the clear lead in this game now
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wtf what a comeback, it reminds me that game on LT Josez vs Boxer :D
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WTF Casy! NICE! Nada sacs a ton of SCVS to try to take out the men in his base but Casy always there with more dropships!~!!!
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NaDa still more expansions.. he will win
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NaDa has that 2nd expansion, though but he lost like 10 supply depots ^^
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casy pulling an elky but this wont be enough
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Nada been mining @ 6 natural for a while now but he STILL has casy in his main and lost his mining there and now losing the rest of his depots and academy/ armory.
Nada going for a 3 ship counter drop on casys natural and getting crazy scv kills once again.
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If Casy's wins this game, he will have alot of confidence going into the next game.
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NADA DROPING AT CASYS NAT
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both expos of nada dropped
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy missing nadas exp @ the 6 natural is gonna cost him the game.
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Casy dropping both nada's exps. Nada taking otu Casy's nat.
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OMG Nada not mining, Casy wins!!!
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kk NaDa wins
not scouting the 2nd expansion was the key point
and its a 3:0 sweep by nada
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OMG CASY!!!!!!!!!!!!! No words.
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Netherlands19124 Posts
nada moving his forces into casys main where he YET AGAIN barely defends but his 4 golly drop on nadas first natural did take out sooooo many scvs and some gollies too.
This is crazy haha.
If he finds 6 he'll win.
He finds it -.-
Omg lol Casy took nadas facts and nada GGs!
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holy shit!!
what an awesome comeback by casy!!
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OH MY GOD
OH MY GODOH MY GODOH MY GOD OH MY GOD OH MY GOD OH MY GOD
OH MY GODOH MY GOD
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casy early game retard to late game genuis
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Nada gives up the GG!!
Casy 1-2! Unbelievable game!
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ROFL what a comeback ! sweeeeeeeeet play by Casy. Lack of patience by Nada
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FUCKING INSANE DROPSHIP MULTI-ATTACK BY CASY... .AND AMAZING DEFENSE
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Osaka26966 Posts
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OH MY GOD CASY PLAYED LIKE SUCH A FUCKING BOXER
WHO BOXER?
CASY BOXER
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Wow. I thought nada had this game!!! Casy played every move right
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o.OOOOOOOOOO
lol what A WICKED GAME ORLFFORLF!^^^^^^^^
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Casy will not win 3 games in a row vs nada-_-
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FUCK WHAT IN THE FUCK DID YOU SEE IT?
DID ANYONE FUCKING SEE IT?
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-_-;;
He's coming back. My Faith won't waver. Do you know who you are talking about?
Neo, Fuckin, Emperor.
-_-;; I come back from poker to find the last moments of the all in. Whew, go me.
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Holy shit, i'm sensing a comeback now, Casy's filled with confidence YOU GO GIRL!!
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Osaka26966 Posts
casy gotta piss after that
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ok
<3 Casy <3 NaDa
what a game lol shaking my head in disbelief
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THAT'S FUCKING RIGHT!
With that game, Casy says "It's not over yet"
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Netherlands19124 Posts
CRAZY Game, comeback of the season
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That was amazing.Nada shouldnt have made that 3rd expo .
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Sweden1225 Posts
laughs even tho he'll prolly lose i love casy for that comeback =P keeping it alive...
casy = favorite terran fo sho;O
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Don't stop calling him neo emperor ; lol he is not even half of the genius that boxer was ;;
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That was the most intense TvT I've ever watch o_O;
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NaDa dindt do any major mistakes, did he ? It was just Casy playing it.. i dunno i though casy was behind all the time an all of a sudden he wins.. wow
what a game.. stunning..
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Netherlands19124 Posts
I'm afraid this game took ALOT of of casy though, wonder if hes got the stamina for 2x more of this, cause that's what it will take.
Same with RA taking a game vs Savior on peaks but then crumbling cause it took him all he had for just 1 meager win by mutual building elimination.
Or hell gain spirit from it and now go on a crazy rampage, thats the other scenario :p.
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Wow just wow. Now who says tvt is boring? That was a heavy comeback by casy! Battles everywhere, no break, constant drops / attacks. Nice games so far!
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Impossible comeback, beautiful play. Most exciting game I've seen in some time. Everyone must download this VOD.
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And he looks so calm afterwards. Nada meanwhile looking like he just tossed away a winning lotto ticket. Reminds me of the boxer vs pusan comeback, although it hasnt happened yet
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that game was decided when casy made the most perfect drop on the most perfect position ever, and held that spot in nada's base despite all of nada's attempts at defense
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I am big Nada fan, but I will feel robbed if Nada 3-0 Casy! Now you can close it Nada!
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Its just.. NaDa had an much earlier expo, Casy didnt have more units but he just.. won it.. i dont really get it ..
That is a semi final, ffs , yes ya =)))
I guess Iris vs Savior cant match with this one ; D
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Nada's drop was bigger than Casy's but Casy's was positioned better and he managed to hold it and reinforce where Nada lost the men and was using his ships to try to dislodge Casy.
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Hehe yeah if this won't make VOD of the week I dunno what will ^^.
Still some crazy fuckups from casy though due to fucked up scouting which cost him at least the 2nd game in the series.
Like plus minus 7 tanks loss outside nadas nat for nothing and killing like 1 gol 1 tank? :/
Sloppy play, but you could see the sweat pouring out of him so he was beyond stressed and lost his focus.
Glad he came back,
Casy ftw!<3
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genius terran
comeback of the century~!
and vs nada too! fuck me~~~ clever play by Casy!
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Casy 1 Expo = More and better placed drop... remember NaDa wasted 4 tanks on that reversed cliff
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Braavos36362 Posts
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Reminds me of Oov vs Casy. Casy was down 0-2 so pitifully. Then came the 3 games from hell.
I hope I won't be here another 2 hours and Casy just wins with genius.
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Game 3 was awesome. Great game! Must see!
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That has to be one of the first games in a while where the guy with less mins/gas won. Or I assume he had less o_o
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Yep, less gas and mins, still Victorious
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Netherlands19124 Posts
I won't mind nada winning but damn I hope Casy makes a series out of it and at least makes it 3-2 for whomever wins. This series deserves it if theres more games like the last one.
And if casy pulls through now, he's the man with the mentality to go against (most likely) the Matler.
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OH MY GOD WHAT IN THE HELL
there will never be enough "OH MY GODS" to encompass how amazing that game was
beautiful decision making by casy in the last 4 minutes of the game
fucking perfect brilliant minded casy
wowowowowo
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u gotta skate8152 Posts
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did you all saw that - casy average APM OMFG
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On February 14 2007 02:56 Day[9] wrote: OH MY GOD WHAT IN THE HELL
there will never be enough "OH MY GODS" to encompass how amazing that game was
beautiful decision making by casy in the last 4 minutes of the game
fucking perfect brilliant minded casy
wowowowowo
get a hold of yourself!
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Jesus christ i totally forgot about today and it was on my mind ALL weekend.
asdfsadf i hope i didnt miss much..
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Can someone korean translate how the commentators reacted/are reacting? Are they as amazed as us?
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On February 14 2007 02:57 G.s)NarutO wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 02:56 Day[9] wrote: OH MY GOD WHAT IN THE HELL
there will never be enough "OH MY GODS" to encompass how amazing that game was
beautiful decision making by casy in the last 4 minutes of the game
fucking perfect brilliant minded casy
wowowowowo get a hold of yourself!
cannot.....
OMFGFDKJSLGKDFSLGJKLDFSOMGOMGOMFG
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And it was mostly nada's building placement that screwed him over ;; how sad
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wow
lets see how NaDa's answer will look like.. Casys inhaling, exhaling looking confident again Nadas smiling - knowing he will have to fight now ? Or prepearing another rape ?
I hate 2:2 , because its just so intense then.. i barely can stand it.. D: so plz nada just finish it ^^
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Netherlands19124 Posts
haha in hindsight when seeing the replay, nada owned himself with that half completed depot infront of Casys drop in his main which ended up blocking all his scvs and leaving no room for the dropped units :p.
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On February 14 2007 02:58 GoBOXERgogo wrote: Can someone korean translate how the commentators reacted/are reacting? Are they as amazed as us?
They are excited as fuck... they keep saying "This is Han Dongwook" "This is Casy"
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Nada shouldve waited for his 3rd gaz to kick in, I think he was overly agressive
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On February 14 2007 02:57 PanoRaMa wrote: Jesus christ i totally forgot about today and it was on my mind ALL weekend.
asdfsadf i hope i didnt miss much.. Only the biggest comeback in recent memory
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can anyone show liquibet votes for this match ?;-)
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On February 14 2007 02:57 Da_PlayerX wrote: did you all saw that - casy average APM OMFG
didnt see it how much was it ?
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That 3rd game might have greatly shifted the confidences of the players and increase Casy's chance. Casy played flawlessly after the huge setback.
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AHH someone tell me what was the BIG play that just happened FIVE MINUTES BEFORE I REMEMBERED OSL WAS ON.
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Game 4 comming up!
Longinus, Casy yellow @ bott , Nada Teal @ top left
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Casy yellow 7 Nada teal 11.
Longinus II.
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On February 14 2007 03:01 PanoRaMa wrote: AHH someone tell me what was the BIG play that just happened FIVE MINUTES BEFORE I REMEMBERED OSL WAS ON.
cant describe it in one sentence.. dl the vod is my advice
game 3 STaRTING
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy moving out with a timely scout for once and takes some dodgy scout path towards top left, maybe has some proxy faxing in mind?
Started rax in main so dunno
Ah just scouts top left, maybe was some indecisiveness where to scout.
Both dance the scv dance in nadas main.
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same builds for both.. supply rax raf
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On February 14 2007 03:02 MaGic~PhiL wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 03:01 PanoRaMa wrote: AHH someone tell me what was the BIG play that just happened FIVE MINUTES BEFORE I REMEMBERED OSL WAS ON. cant describe it in one sentence.. dl the vod is my advice game 3 STaRTING
hahaha bastard
Well at least tell me what kind of nasty name Casy has now...AdarneS or something?
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ROFL anyone see the scv? hahahah
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NaDas factory coming down 6 seconds earlier
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rofl the scouting scvs are breakdance fighting!
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OOOH casy sEES nadas fast CC
and is building a starport now
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Nada takes his exp while pumping some rines.
Casy starts a port and heads out with a vult/rines.
Nada has some vults roaming about himself with some rines taking a random hike.
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Casy had early scout and denied Nada a scout this time so it's Casy with a little more information.
Nada with fast cc Casy with fast port again.
Casy doing the 4 rine + vult rush.
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ok if casy attacks now nada is in deep shit
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LOL raped!
Nada defends, but that starport could hurt him
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OMG nada in deep trouble now as 2 vult 4 marine tear up nada who only has 1 vult 2 rine.
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well.. Nadas tank comes in handily and with like 4-5 scv loses he defends
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy heads into nadas expo attempt and finds the cc before its finished. Some rines and vults vs vults scvs and a tank from nada.
Nada defends but loses some units / scvs in the process and finds his exp delayed by a sec or 20.
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Osaka26966 Posts
does wraith decide the series?
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Nada sees the wraith with cloak upgrd now.
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Nada loses several scvs and has his CC delayed. Casy taking the quick advantage this time.
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Casy's wraith in Nada's main. Nada killing Casy stray tank with 4 vult.
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NADA TRIES TO IGNORE THE WRAITH and instead kills a tank with vults
Casys clearly leading now.. the wraith do so much damage
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Casy is finally playing like Casy
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Nada moving out with some vults/ tank and casy taking a peek with a Wraith @ nada as he harasses some scvs and scores some kills.
Casy loses his tank vs some vults in the middle of nowhere and blocks his ramp with mines / rax.
Nada gonna lose his tank @ casys ramp to a wraith.
Casy took his natural btw a min or 2 ago.
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Osaka26966 Posts
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Gollies out for nada and 2 comsats just finished.
Slowly lost quite some scvs to 2 wraiths though who cloak and sod off when the gollies with scan show.
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Cloak wraiths harassing even more scvs of Nada.
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Casy harrasing and doing much damage in the mean time he has expanded ,too and Casy is no in the lead he is just pissing on nadas eco
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Nada planting mass mines in front of casy
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this is goin to be loooooong game...
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Random mines in places as nada is pretty vulture heavy and tries to delay casy with that.
Casy addings facts, up to 4 now.
Casy clearing mines with tanks / rine slowly forward.
Pretty entertaining for the crowd.
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Casy knows he's got a solid lead and is going up to 5 facs.
Casy with some pimp rine + siege tank mine clearing.
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Nadas force looks weaker.. he has that totally useless 7tish vults now..
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On February 14 2007 03:09 Manifesto7 wrote: nada gonna lose
yes please.
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Casy pushing forward + harassing but losing both wraiths
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OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM GGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG
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oki casy fucked that up,lost 20vult for nothin
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy moving out with a sizeable force. Wraiths still roaming and scoring scv kills @ natas nat every now and then.
Casy added quite some vults now as well.
Casy loses his wraiths @ nadas nat to gols which DID succes in nada pushing his force sback a bit.
Major fight @ nadas second nat where casys miscontrolls and loses his whole army vs too little from nada.
THis might be a mean counter comming up as casy tries to take his 2nd nat (min only). Which nada sees with the mines still there.
Nada wants to take 12 dual gas and just barely dodges the 2 vults that casy sent there to scout.
Nada drops some gollies on casys exp but casy defends decisively as he takes some scvs down.
Nada patrols casys main with his dship to have a peek.
Casy adding some turrets / tanks @ his exp for statis defense.
Now its casy mining and patrolling like crazy as nada is loading up on d ships.
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how did nada defend this .. and casy was maybe kina too offensive now ? and suddenly nadas has a bigger force
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The vult losses won't matter that much because they don't require gas but Casy's attack still not successful.
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Nada harrasing with a drop ship doing no damage just byuing some time
casy expanding at his mins only
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Casy seems determined to go lots of vultures since he expands min only. I would think he'd want 5 o'clock double gas.
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Nada prepearing more drop ships now
probably going for.. well the mins only but he didnt do much
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big loss for nada here but the games pretty open, still
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Casy looks gold everytime camera takes him, its like he is doin some marathon running :D
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy sees nadas Dships as they move in for a move on his main perhaps but is forces to withdraw or unload @ casys 2nd nat and face the music there.
Nada decides to unload and engage and gets rinsed by the present forces + scvs.
Nada once again gets his drop spotted by vults placed @ the 9 o clock dual gas exp.
Casy loses those vults but its of no concern having spotted that exp.
Casy drops a mass of units @ 9 and kills the units nada still had there from that drop.
Nada still down to 1 exp, might be taking 12 though they dont show.
Ah yes he just finished a CC there but casy has a vult poking at it.
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too much happening now ^^
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Netherlands19124 Posts
nada moving like all his units to defend 12 before it even gets attacked.
Casy drops units right behind its mineral line though and intercept the maynarding scvs.
As nada moves in more to defend Casy attacks frontally with a taskforce on Nadas natural and scores again some good unit kills and take more then a dozen scvs with him to the grave.
Now its nada who moves his tanks (about 8) to have a peek @ casys 2nd natural but runs into mines.
Casy moving like 7 dropships into Nadas main!!!
Doesnt seem to unload everything hes got there though.
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i have no clue who will win this
looks like we will have a 2:2 soon
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Haha, now nada defends the drop with a drop casy drops his remaining units ONTOP of Nadas defensive drop and they both end up with no units left there.
(that was alot of drop in 1 sentence -.-)
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NaDa is passive and Casys just sooo good right now agrressive ass helllll
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy taking the bottom (5) dual gas expo which just finished.
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casy making turrets all over the map (fag)
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy putting up random turrets everywhere and has a REALLY good view of the whole map.
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I think Casy has this. Nada has almost no units.
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Casy has superior expo count much more gas this is so much casys game right now
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy going for a drop again on nadas 2nd natural where there is no expansion and both players end up dropped out of range of eachother and stalemating a bit.
TvT is damn fun if its a gg :D.
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Casy has the whole map .. lol !?
looks really nasty for nada now.. i wonder who the macro end game multitakser is.. it looks
omg casy has SO much more
GG from NaDa
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casy is all over nada this game =]
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NaDa got raped now.. like he raped casy game 1 and 2
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Casy going up 5 base to 3 in addition to the turret spam all over the map.
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy taking the 3 o clock main as he drops EVERYTHING and its mother on Nada and moves in a crazy ground army as well.
Both take insane unit casualties but with Casys income nada needs to kill units 2 to 1 or 3 to 1 to make a dent.
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if u look at minimap u will know who is running this shit casy got 80percent of the map control
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Casy as so much of the map.. NaDa cant come back.. no way
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haha, i think it's time for mass ebays
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nada should give up its a pain to watch this.. ouch casys just awesome as well. wowow
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Netherlands19124 Posts
If nada doesn't seize the initiative this is over while casy turrets up casually all along the map haha and still has some seiger tanks outside of Nadas nat which Nada is currently dealing with.
Casy loading a monstrous amount of units up again.
If he can take the fight to the 12 dual gas exp and take it. This is gg.
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wow nada defends a huge drop at 12 with minimal losses... nice!
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Casy is outplaying nada now.. lol ^^
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wow, Nada is defending really well. However Casy eco is way ahead.
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Yup casy hitting 12 and putting the HURT on the Scvs there as Nada drops on his drop and succesfully defends.
Casy takes the 3 o clock natural and 9 dual gas now as well.
hes got the whole map -.-.
Nada trying to take initiative and moving units through the middle and clearing some random turrets.
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casy can attack at will right now and win this -_-
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6 base to 3 now, Casy takes the 9 exp.
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Nadas macro is very impressive, like 6 starports for Casy
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lol casy need stargates to finish it TT thats pretty lame
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this is so over.. nada plz gg mass wraith coming soon for casy we will se a 5th deciding game FOLKS !!!
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Both players seem to be setting up shop at and around the 3 o clock main to see if theres something to be done there.
Nada finds casys drop as he flies right over some of his gollies and loses a dship or 2 I think.
nada retreats to deal with the drop and lozes initiative AGAIN, as casy loses every single dropship he has.
Both engage in the middle in a mass battle where Casy comes out just ontop and both settle down again...
Casy adding 2 more armories and 6 Starports. (No addons yet so wraiths?)
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Casy seems to have few men cuz of all the scv + going the mass starport for, presumably, BC.
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mass wraiths will piss on nada, soon if he doesnt gg before..
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Nada loading up again and going for 9 dual gas as Casy is taking out Nadas natural and at this rate soon his main + factories too as Nada kills 9 but which doesnt even put a dent in Casys economy.
A cloud of wraiths forming for Casy...
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nada has absoultely zero troops at home, all are out fighting...
he kills 9:00 though lses 12:00 he can't afford to swap expos with casy
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mass wraiths come in killing all the dropships
gg
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Casy's wraith take out Nada's ships as Nada trying to save 12. Nada GG 2-2.
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy moving in on 12 and taking it out as well now unless Nada can haul his shit back from 9 in time to deal with it.
Too late hes gonna lose it anyway and Casy intercepts nadas dship fleet with his wraith cloud and its gg!
VERY WELL PLAYED from casy,
well done.
Stuff that people who said Nada was dominating Casy .
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gG NaDa deciding 5th i think Casy finally found his play.. wowow 5th game incoming
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On February 14 2007 03:25 FalliNinLove wrote: lol casy need stargates to finish it TT thats pretty lame Wtf -___- it's a very common strtegy with terrans so far ahead.
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2:0 rape NaDa 2:0 rape Casy
2:2
5th game ~> close as hell and a lucky winner ? ; P
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Casy demonstrates to us the merits of aggression
whether or not you win purely by relentless aggression, you provide yourself countless opportunities to expand and/or gain map control
Beautiful yet again
<3 to Casy : ]
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Netherlands19124 Posts
This series is crazy entertaining.
Nada taking his jacket off for the last game! :D
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Wow, that was such a dominating game by Casy. I must say I'm very impressed. I wouldn't be surprised if he takes next match...
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so exciting! come on tornado!
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One of them is gonna cheese this 5th, you just know it. Cant wait
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Indeed amazing play by Casy the harras kept NaDa at home and NaDa couldnt do anything .. Casy just pwned ^^
well i still hope NaDa makes it even though ive got to admit, that Casy is a new gernation terran and absolutely a force =)
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u gotta skate8152 Posts
Gogogogo Casy shut him down! :D
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I think Casy gonna win next game; he now knows what NOT to do; cause of game 1 ^^
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Seriously, the way NaDa handled some of those attacks is just sick. I hope he can win in the last game
GO GO Nada
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Nada analysing the replay, with a gameface on and jacket off.
The smiles gone, the man means business now... Casy still looks nervous and sweaty as always with his breathing settled and hes focussed now. It's in the eyes!
It's Casy today with the higher APM, about 100 average higher then Nada for those who think it means anything .
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It will be nice 5th game both going M&M
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O GOD.. It's Arkanoid. OH NO!!!!!!!!
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Holy shit 418 apm..
God damn Casy is machinelike.
If he wins this, it gives him +1 for deserving the Neo-BoxeR nick, after BoxeR had pulled an amazing 3-2 comeback in a semifinal of an OSL..
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ok Casy just has higher apm than nada !? is casy known for such high apm.. he really must have played like madman.. as if his life dependet on it ;D
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Great fighting will by Casy, but please NaDa win!!!!
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Casy played from ahead much better than Nada taking full map control with turrets.
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wow i've never enjoyed tvt this much before, these have been great games (except that last one kinda dragged on)
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How sick would it be if NaDa played this strat again on Arkanoid Or if Nada played fast CC and Casy uses NaDas m&m strart !? Lets see how it will all turn out ;D
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How fast is everyone's pulse?
My heart is actually pumping faster... And I am stone cold... god, I do not wanna lose this bet. I was so cocky when I did it.
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy keeping the pressure on and not allowing nada to move out won him the game as he took the map. His amazing scouting this game unlike the earlier games put nada in the dark for quite a while and saw and dealt with every drop nada came up with or every flank most efficiently and decisively.
Nada overcommitted a bit as well on some occasions which didn't help him gaining momentum.
Good game! Now lets enjoy the last one :D.
Both deserve to win this, but if Casy takes this last one he's the guy to deal with savior in the finals with his stamina and recovery skills from a devastating 2-0. (presuming savior rapes Iris here -.-)
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Osaka26966 Posts
On February 14 2007 03:32 MaGic~PhiL wrote: How sick would it be if NaDa played this strat again on Arkanoid Or if Nada played fast CC and Casy uses NaDas m&m strart !? Lets see how it will all turn out ;D
nah im going to bed
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All i know is : Casy's TvT is awesome.
ANd i m not even sure if NaDa's Arkanoid play is any better than Casys after seeing casys late game skills and decisionmaking..
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Hong Kong20321 Posts
HOLY FUCK I JUST GOT UP I AM RETARDED ;\
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man im looking foward to these vods. 5 + pages of "omfg casy" makes me excited!
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On February 14 2007 03:33 SuperJongMan wrote: How fast is everyone's pulse?
My heart is actually pumping faster... And I am stone cold... god, I do not wanna lose this bet. I was so cocky when I did it.
I am not that excited about the bet, but I want Nada to win so bad. Nada vs Savior finals would be very interesting.
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Netherlands19124 Posts
On February 14 2007 03:34 alffla wrote: HOLY FUCK I JUST GOT UP I AM RETARDED ;\
Haha owned, get the vods of each and every game, its all amazing to watch. At least your in time for the grand finale of this series :D.
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On February 14 2007 03:33 SuperJongMan wrote: How fast is everyone's pulse?
My heart is actually pumping faster... And I am stone cold... god, I do not wanna lose this bet. I was so cocky when I did it. I voted for Casy too Very exciting. Although I've basically quit trying on liquibet since I lost the big MBC vs sktelecome a while ago
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it's game time baby
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Game 5 Neo Arkanoid nada top left (yellow) casy top right (orange)
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Both look business now, and its starting!
Arkanoid again, lets see how casy deels with it.
Casy purple top right, Nada Yellow top left.
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Game starting.
Arkanoid G5.
Casy top right purple. Nada top left yellow.
GL GG!!!
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i have never been this nervous about a game before
omg if casy wins, this will be epic
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LOL my bad -_-;; Wasn't talking liquibet. lol cutie pies.
At least Day agrees. This is a huge moment if Casy comes back 0-2 against Nada's TvT.
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Wow casy looking really focussed, and nada too.
No smiles here this time.
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both 14-CC casy using 2 SCVs to kill the pods though and nada just making an out-of-place CC with a rax near it. He'll probable make some marines to kill he pods
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Netherlands19124 Posts
If casy wins this it's a series for the history of the game. Crazy stuff.
Nada and casy both going for a cc next to the cryxalises as some scvs go at them.
They both expanded towards eachother.
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both finish expo at the same time, looks like casy's strat will be better, it may give him the tiniest of leads
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Belgium6733 Posts
Just got home in time I see
Go nada!
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Nada ignores the neutral buildings as casy killed them with his scvs.
Nada now killing them with a rine but casy has a small mining advantage here for a while.
Both working on facts.
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If NaDa lose, I'll do suicide.
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy clearing the neutrals @ his other expo with a rine while nada clears the neutrals @ his expo with 3 rines now.
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Arkanoid is NaDa map! He can't lose!
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Netherlands19124 Posts
2 ports from nada vs facts from casy.
brb toilet --.--
gogo resonate
nada clears the neutral buildings finishes gas there and now sends his cc to the best position while blocking his landing with his own scv -.-
Nada scouts casy with his rax
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nada floats his nat CC into position nada scouts casy's 2-fac port build
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casy sees the wraiths coming miles away
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Catyoul
France2377 Posts
Wow, just in time though it seems I've missed an awesome series. Did casy just kill his own marine with a few of his scvs to free some supply ? :D
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nada takes his 3rd base, knowing he will have air-control for a few more minutes with his wraiths.
casy 4-fac gollies, nada making tanks from 1 fac (adding 2nd)
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casy killing some neutral buildings at his side of the map
nada massing wraiths, he is mining his 3rd base now
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casy moves out into the middle with a lot of gollies and a couple of dropships
he's going towards nada's 3rd base
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drop on nada's 9:00
casy kills the command centre nada's really in trouble...
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nada defends with tanks and re-makes the command centre, but he got a real blow then. he's not using his wraiths very well
drop at nada's 12:00 expo, clears with wraith/tank again
casy finishes his expo at 3:00
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy dropped a boatload of gollies on nadas bottom expo @ 10 and takes it out. Now killing the defending tanks sent to reinforce as well, but even more tanks finish the follies as he starts a new CC there and roms some with his cloaked wraiths.
Casy doesnt let up the pressure and attacks Nadas other expo and kills a load of scvs there and a defending tank.
Nada cleans the gols and kills the dropship that dropped them.
Now roams the map for a bit as Casy takes his 2nd expo.
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really, i think it' spretty even so far. nada's sniping dropships like a champ, and will have his exp back before casy has his 3rd up i think
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Game loses a bit of momentum as both players settle down and casy adds some turrets to hit bottom expansion.
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nada switched back to ground metal from 3 fac at the moment, still wraiths harrassing too.
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casy starts to make turrets at the lower 3:00 base, nada is massing facts now, up to 6
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy dropping an SCV at the top expo from the bottom right main and nada misses it barely with his wraiths. He then does see the d ship flying on and kills it.
Casy adding some random turrets with a seeming mineral exess.
Casy already broke out through the neutrals into the mid and nada is now clearing his own as well.
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy setting up shop outside nadas bottom natural while clearing some more neutrals as nada moves out and runs into Casys mini contain.
Both lose units, but some cute tanks from casy prevent further troop movement.
Casy added some turrets to the 4 o clock expo but isnt taking it yet.
Some tanks outside nadas main entrance poke a bit at eachother as nada moves out with d ships and casy too.
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nada doing an average job of defending his 12:00 expo
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suffeli
Finland772 Posts
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Casy is getting offensive again.. its no good
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy dropping nadas expo @ 11.5 and is taking it out. Nada dropped his units someplace where they are doing .. nothing. As casy sets up even more shop outside of nadas expo and nada runs ALL his wraiths (like 8?) into the contain and loses them all.
Nada throwing everything + the kitchen sink at Casys move on his natural but loses a ton of scvs and dships + random attack units.
Casys tanks cant hit the CC though.
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ok it looks like NaDa has 2 more xpos !?
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suffeli
Finland772 Posts
Casy should take care of Nadas nat soon.
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Netherlands19124 Posts
If casy gets one more attack in the other expo or takes out the top one he'll have a sizeable momentum again this game but hell need to act.
And yes! Casy mass dropping on some defending units @ nadas bottom expo and nada drops on the drop again and comes out on top.
Both lose quite some units though and casy was poking at nadas economy quite a bit already while nada hasnt even touched Casys.
Nada taking bottom left expo.
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Nadas prepearing something big
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy moving in for the kill on nadas top expo but Nada defends decisively there and Casy loses whatever contain he had there but takes out most scvs there again, cc still stands though.
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expo count for both players?
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy clears the units from nada @ the top expo from bottom right main.
Nada sending a BIG d ship fleet there though but both are reinforcing...
Nada more tanks and no cleared neutral buildings there yet so Nada has this and Casy will lose that expo.
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ok Nada is looking much better now Casys offensive moves dont pay off at all nadas expo count is higher
NADA BIG DROP INCOMING ! ok nadas game imho
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Catyoul
France2377 Posts
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Catyoul
France2377 Posts
Casy going for an attack on nada's expos at bottoml eft
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Casy now droping SUCCESFULLY KILLING a expansion of NaDa !
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nada is relentlessly stopping casy from taking his 4th gas in fact he's just killed the 4th CC
casy's early aggression seemed to be really positive but it's turning around to bite him in the ass now...
ok casy drops nada's 4th gas and kills it
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Nada is still comfortable @ bottom left main which he just finished so he clearly gas the advantage now unless casy can stop it.
Casy mined out his 12.5 expo as he tries to attack nadas bottom exp.
Nada is RIGHT back in time to defend there but he underestimated and didnt commit enough troops and loses the battle but hes comming back with more units now.
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy dropped bottom left main as well so Both have hurting ecos now.
Interesting situation.
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Catyoul
France2377 Posts
Nada has less units in his dropships than i thought :o
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nada defends effortlessly, as you knew he would, but casy hunts down nada's 4th CC and kills it
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Is Casy dieing cause he has no more mins soon ????
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Catyoul
France2377 Posts
On February 14 2007 03:57 Nyovne wrote: Casy dropped bottom left main as well so Both have hurting ecos now.
Interesting situation. Nada's eco >> Casy's eco for a long time
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nada still has an army at the bottom right stopping casy expanding there.
casy takes great efforts to clear that now, allowing him to expand
nada still has the bottom left main so he's 4 base to 3
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Casy has not enough expos.. but nadas got destroyed as well i cant see the colours on the mini map that well.. i dont know exactly who has what expos..
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Catyoul
France2377 Posts
Casy desroys Nada's remaining bottom left exp
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cay moving on nada's 4th base now with ground and dropships
nada is totalyl out-numbered down there and lets it die
both now on 3-gaas econ again tho nada is re-taking his 9:00
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omg this will come down to one deciding battle LOL!!
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Catyoul
France2377 Posts
Nada's second nat almost mined out
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but seems as if nada has much more units ????
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OMG this is even better than game 3. Both about to mine out from their 3 starting bases!
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man this is exciting, i suspect one last final attack for both anyone can win, ups NADA won it, its gg:DDD
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Catyoul
France2377 Posts
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nada does a huge ground and air attack on casy's army at the bottom righ and kills it all
casy moves out through the middle.
both have only 1 base half-full left
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Catyoul
France2377 Posts
On February 14 2007 04:01 nova_442 wrote: OMG this is even better than game 3. Both about to mine out from their 3 starting bases! I think NAda has a lot more units
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nada moving in on casy's main now...
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ok Nada wins casy has nothing LEFT GG CASY
NADA IS IN THE FINAL !!!
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Nice play by Nada, Casy cant defend this
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Netherlands19124 Posts
Casy going at nadas main but nada has too many units there as well.
gg!
Nada advances after a crazy series of 5 which could have gone either way .
Shame I would have liked casy to take it after those first 2 games :D. Still crazy comeback!
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Very nice bo5. Casy had trouble getting a 4th base in this game and even though he killed Nada's 4th and 5th bases, the resources Nada mined from them first really helped.
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.... It hurts so much. Oov vs Casy game 5... Nada vs Casy game 5...
GOD it hurts.
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All the time I wanted the yellow one to win thinking that he is casy:-))
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lol tl.net went down for like 10 min
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uff... even i'm tired after watching such intense games. I don't even want to imagine how casy and nada feel right now...
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Russian Federation1953 Posts
I think even very rabid Casy fans should agree NaDa is better player (not counting past achievements)
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NaDa you mother fucking beast.
I feel SO DAMN bad for Casy though.
He will win next OSL, provided Midas doesn't ace his way through it without a single loss first.
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The most exciting tvt bo5 I've ever seen.
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On February 14 2007 04:14 PaleMan wrote: I think even very rabid Casy fans should agree NaDa is better player (not counting past achievements)
No -_-;; Sorry... I'm blaming this one 2x Arkanoid. Fuck Nada on Arkanoid...
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I was hoping for NaDa the entire 5th game.. now I wish Casy won T_T
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Hong Kong20321 Posts
NADA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
what was it.." THE YOON YEOL SUN TZUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU!!!!!!!"" or some shit
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Great series, great play by both players. Amazing display of tvt skills. NaDa`s tvt is becoming really scary. Casy was unlucky with last map :D
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BTW... I'm cheering for Iris for OSL champ now. Fuck this nonsense.
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SJM you sound like me after the Midas loss
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On February 14 2007 04:16 Blind wrote: The most exciting tvt bo5 I've ever seen. You must be blind then.
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On February 14 2007 04:19 SuperJongMan wrote: BTW... I'm cheering for Iris for OSL champ now. Fuck this nonsense.
Nada - #1 TvT in the world.
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On February 14 2007 04:19 SuperJongMan wrote: BTW... I'm cheering for Iris for OSL champ now. Fuck this nonsense.
you mean MSL?
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Gooo NaDa, that was my first live game I've seen. I really liked game 3 and game 5.
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Nada! As I said earlier Nada can't lose with 2 times Neo Arkanoid in the serie. Now Nada is officially invincible on Neo Arkanoid.! Go all the way Nada! We believe!
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NaDas macro was so strong !? I mean they played both very very well but in the end Nada drops like 12 tanks and 8 golis in casys main and casy has nothing .. wow
intense series and both would have equally deserved it. Nada owns on Arkanoid because Arkanoid is the map where u need the most multitasking and where u can do sooo many things that benefit u..
but awesome series. I hated TvT but i really begin to like it.. = D
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dang i'm sad. GG both players tho. Very good series.
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On February 14 2007 04:13 M2 wrote: All the time I wanted the yellow one to win thinking that he is casy:-)) haha , me to gg's
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On February 14 2007 04:20 siro) wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 04:19 SuperJongMan wrote: BTW... I'm cheering for Iris for OSL champ now. Fuck this nonsense. Nada - #1 TvT in the world.
Nada #1 Arkanoid in the world. -_-;;
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On February 14 2007 04:20 Gokey wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 04:16 Blind wrote: The most exciting tvt bo5 I've ever seen. You must be blind then. You're so clever.
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congrats Nada, crush everything!!!
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the parrallels between this series and the casy/oov series are remarkable, even down to the maps (oov was invincible on rush hour 2, as is nada on arkanoid, and they were the maps for games 1+5)
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on the other hand.. Mr.SuperJongMan it doesnt really matter if arkanoid is played twice, because its TvT and u cant really blame the map if casy loses. Its NaDas strength, that he is so good on Arkanoid and i would totally understand if someones mad at Arkanoid twice if its vs p or vs z but TvT its balanced and its just Nadas gift and skill that he dominates on Arkanoid and Casy should have come up with something special, but he played the same strat twice.. and well.. once he got cheesed on arkanoid and died.. in the replay u could even see he saw the rines with his rax but didnt build a vult.. i mean wtf..
and the deciding game on Arkanoid was just better macro and multitasking by NaDa and nada one on one other map, too so u cant really say NaDa is only Arkanoid.. i dont like if u blame Casys lose on Arkanoid only.. i mean seriously.. tt
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
On February 14 2007 04:31 Resonate wrote: the parrallels between this series and the casy/oov series are remarkable, even down to the maps (oov was invincible on rush hour 2, as is nada on arkanoid, and they were the maps for games 1+5)
Watch NaDa 3-0 savior just like OOv 3-0ed July...
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Not map imba, style imba. Casy's style not as suited for Arkanoid as Longinus.
Also, understand I came in at the end of game 3 after a pokernight and I saw game 3 end, game 4 and game 5.
What a cooler. I don't care what others say but deep down inside, I honestly do believe Nada was lucky to have gotten Arkanoid twice, and it was the greatest contributor to his success. Feel free to differ. I feel what I feel.
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Of course it's luck for Nada Arkanoid was played twice, it's his best map and definitely not Casy's best. Had RLT been played twice, Casy would've been lucky.
Nada was definitely not the superior player of the series. He had excellent micro, macro and multitasking, the usual Nada strengths, but strategically, Casy was much better. His drop dynamics, his unit formations, there were many unique things by Casy in those games. That, and game 4 was one of the most dominant high-class TvT I've seen in a while.
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Braavos36362 Posts
orome what do you mean nada was not strategically the better player... did you not watch games 1 and 2??
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On February 14 2007 04:38 Orome wrote: Of course it's luck for Nada Arkanoid was played twice, it's his best map and definitely not Casy's best. Had RLT been played twice, Casy would've been lucky.
Nada was definitely not the superior player of the series. He had excellent micro, macro and multitasking, the usual Nada strengths, but strategically, Casy was much better. His drop dynamics, his unit formations, there were many unique things by Casy in those games. That, and game 4 was one of the most dominant high-class TvT I've seen in a while.
I admit I am a die-hard NaDa fan, but what you wrote is nonsense.
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And once again some Nada haters manage to twist the truth. Basicaly the same when some ***** said that Anytime was the better player in the final, even though he lost, because he played worse.
n/C
yes Casy lost 2:3 , got raped in game 1 and 2, but lets face it : Casy was the better player in the series.. Nada actually sucked.. nada was fucking weak.. seriously..Casy deserved it so much more.. lets face it..
T_T
Arkanoid was lucky for NaDa, but its not luck dependet that NaDa is so good on Arkanoid its just that the map fits ..
still Casy was better player i agree.. casy should have won.. yes..
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Strategically as in drop strategics, not openings.
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Braavos36362 Posts
game 1 nada had a brilliant build and got a little lucky game 2 nada dominated game 3 nada was ahead due but casy made a ridiculous comeback game 4 casy dominated game 5 really close but nada multitask pulled him ahead
its a mirror matchup, don't see how anyone can say casy was the better player, better players WIN
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Braavos36362 Posts
On February 14 2007 04:45 Orome wrote: Strategically as in drop strategics, not openings. thats a pretty narrow definition of "strategically"
99% of the time when people say "player X is strategically better than player Y" they mean builds and overall game strategy not a specific part like "drops"
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On February 14 2007 04:38 Orome wrote: ...That, and game 4 was one of the most dominant high-class TvT I've seen in a while.
And game 1 and 2 werent dominant at all, were they !? No i agree actually game 1 and 2 were close as hell and NaDa barely won them..
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On February 14 2007 04:46 Hot_Bid wrote: ...game 1 nada had a brilliant build and got a little lucky...
BRILLIANT BUILD Nada has no strategic skills ok. wtf
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On February 14 2007 04:46 Hot_Bid wrote: game 1 nada had a brilliant build and got a little lucky game 2 nada dominated game 3 nada was ahead due but casy made a ridiculous comeback game 4 casy dominated game 5 really close but nada multitask pulled him ahead
its a mirror matchup, don't see how anyone can say casy was the better player, better players WIN
yea lol the better player won.. its not like a map imba or race imba whoever played the best wins
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
It was pretty clearly two different series today.
Games 1, 2, and first half of game 3 weren't by Casy at all. They were probably by Casy[name] or something instead, someone who tricked his way into that booth.
Then like halfway through Casy took over the controls and started playing awesomezorz. NaDa was caught off guard until game 5, when he took that break beforehand and turned on Genius mode and adapted to Casy, winning a pure skill no-luck straightup TvT on that map.
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hot bid, how is the bracket contest going? I totally forget the site/my login, do you have a leaderboard?
I have nada/savior final.
And I don't see how anyone can argue nada's #1 TvT.
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On February 14 2007 04:46 Hot_Bid wrote: game 1 nada had a brilliant build and got a little lucky game 2 nada dominated game 3 nada was ahead due but casy made a ridiculous comeback game 4 casy dominated game 5 really close but nada multitask pulled him ahead
its a mirror matchup, don't see how anyone can say casy was the better player, better players WIN
They both played great, both with their respective strengths. I would say Casy played a little better. Maybe more beautiful fits what I want to say more than better. He showed a greater TvT understanding.
On February 14 2007 04:47 Hot_Bid wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 04:45 Orome wrote: Strategically as in drop strategics, not openings. thats a pretty narrow definition of "strategically" 99% of the time when people say "player X is strategically better than player Y" they mean builds and overall game strategy not a specific part like "drops"
Yeah probably. I couldn't think of a better word, what would've been a more appropriate wording? English isn't my first language.
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
see, just because casy ran roughshod over nada in game 4 doesn't mean that much. nada played sublimely well in game 5 and even though it seemed close, it was a lot of little things by nada that made him end up with so many units that could rape casy's main
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I didn't go to school which is cool and Nada won which severly saddens me.
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How can u say he showed a greater understanding of TvT if he loses ? Seriously.. Game 1 and 2 were hardcore rape by NaDa. Game 3 and 4 were hardcore rape by Casy. Game 5 was close till the end until NaDa won with superior macro. So basicaly : Games 1 and 2 : +2 for nada and game 3 and 4 : +2 for Casy.
Game 5 NaDa'S so.. i cant understand how u still think Casys better or understand TvT better or whatever.. Its the same with the anytime vs nada series. Some fags just.. said anytime was better even though he fucked up game 5 and lost to an awesome timing and macro from NaDa and still some said anytime was better than NaDa. Thats just blin bias. Im a NaDa fan, yes , but i would never said NaDa was better than Casy if he lost to Casy cause its totally absurd AND ESPECIALLY absurd after we saw game 1 and 2... whatever.. some people are just blind. Orome u are one of these guys who still cant accept NaDa is godly, even after he wins his 4th OSl arent u ??
n/C..
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On February 14 2007 04:49 MaGic~PhiL wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 04:46 Hot_Bid wrote: ...game 1 nada had a brilliant build and got a little lucky...
BRILLIANT BUILD Nada has no strategic skills ok. wtf
You seem a bit confused there between the two blue names.
But anyway, while it's lucky for NaDa to get his ace map twice in a bo5, isn't it ultimately each player's responsibility to be able to master the maps anyway? The maps rotate every several months, and each new map change a player's true ability is measured additionally by his performance on new maps (aka why immense practice is necessary). In other words, NaDa's superb play on Arkanoid is a by-product of his overall ability, then?
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On February 14 2007 04:44 MaGic~PhiL wrote: And once again some Nada haters manage to twist the truth. Basicaly the same when some ***** said that Anytime was the better player in the final, even though he lost, because he played worse.
That ***** was DJEtterStyle, maybe the most knowledge person about progaming on this forum.
I won't even quote the rest of that post, it's ridiculous and not in any way what I said.
On February 14 2007 04:48 MaGic~PhiL wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 04:38 Orome wrote: ...That, and game 4 was one of the most dominant high-class TvT I've seen in a while. And game 1 and 2 werent dominant at all, were they !? No i agree actually game 1 and 2 were close as hell and NaDa barely won them..
Game 1 was a build order win. Game 2 was dominant, but Casy was playing badly. In game 4, Nada was playing well, that's what made Casy's domination impressive.
This is what I mean with you getting annoying when you start fanboying. You get way too emotional about things.
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On February 14 2007 04:46 Hot_Bid wrote: game 1 nada had a brilliant build and got a little lucky game 2 nada dominated game 3 nada was ahead due but casy made a ridiculous comeback game 4 casy dominated game 5 really close but nada multitask pulled him ahead
its a mirror matchup, don't see how anyone can say casy was the better player, better players WIN
this is simple minded bullshit
1) Nada did a standard cheese. This doesn't say much at all. This doesn't say nada was good. This doesn't say nada was bad. I will admit, the cheese had that "nada timing" to it, but nothing else much
2) Nada made a single excellent decision early game: the choice to perform the 7 marine + tank + vulture rush after he saw the fast CC. This decision alone was the only truly "brilliant" move that nada pulled during the game. After that crushing blow, nada simply played solidly and aggressively for the remainder of the game
3) Casy got a bit screwed by Nada's excellent micro early on. Despite being hammered in the face for the rest of the game, numerous key decisions in the last several minutes of the game pulled a brilliant comeback by Casy. Nada didn't exactly make any mistakes, Casy just made vastly superior decisions. For example, Casy opted to sack his natural expansion (his only running expansion) for the opportunity to drop both of Nada's running expos w/ 4 gollies. This was the final, brilliant finishing blow.
4) As Orome stated perfectly, I've never seen such a high level TvT outclassing before. Everything about Casy's play dynamic was exceptional. He demonstrated how sick, well timed aggression can not only win at key moments, but also (assuming you haven't won already) provide excellent opportunities to gain map control and expand. A good example of how casy was controlling nada: Casy built turrets at various spots throughout the map. Casy forced Nada to put his army in various places so precisely that Nada never had the opportunity to kill 1 or 2 lone turrets nearby his main in the center of the map. Pulling any terran player, let alone nada, around like that is a hallmark of a superior player
5) Nada made several solid, consistent decisions which won him this game: he continuously dropped and placed tanks effectively at the @3 natural, negating Casy's midgame expansion opportunities. Moreover, Nada had his classic sick macro throughout the game. Nonetheless, Casy relied on finesseful moves and abusing the center position in odd ways to put pressure on Nada in the early-midgame. Again, we saw in this game how effectively Casy can force his opponent's army to be where he wants it. Had Casy secured the @3 expansion a tad sooner, he would have smashed Nada.
Again, we saw very well in the last 3 games the kind of TvT Casy can perform: He knows exactly how and when to attack to force his opponents play. In the first two games, Nada made such well timed/chosen early game attacks, that we didn't get to see Casy shine. In the last game, Casy worked his magic, but couldn't outmacro Nada on 5 gas vs himself on 3. Therefore, although Nada won the series, I feel that Casy is the stronger player.
"better players win" my ass. Ever heard of Silver?
EAT IT HOT BID
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On February 14 2007 04:59 Orome wrote:
That ***** was DJEtterStyle, maybe the most knowledge person about progaming on this forum.
I'd like this title
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If we cant even agree on the fact, that the winner is the better player it gets all a bit complicated. I mean u can say u liked game 1 and 2 less than 3 and 4 and u can say that was lucky and that pure art, but thats all so subjective. SO why not just go with the truth ? NaDa won a close match vs a TvT Ace but in the end NaDa was barely the one to win and since he didnt do any big faults, but just lost two games to one of the bestTvT's ever i dont think u can say Casy was better or Nada didnt deserve it.
Casy played fucking awesome, but nada was just better.
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Day~~ Thank you for coming to my defence. Now we can cry together.
Tissue?
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On February 14 2007 04:59 Day[9] wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 04:46 Hot_Bid wrote: game 1 nada had a brilliant build and got a little lucky game 2 nada dominated game 3 nada was ahead due but casy made a ridiculous comeback game 4 casy dominated game 5 really close but nada multitask pulled him ahead
its a mirror matchup, don't see how anyone can say casy was the better player, better players WIN
this is simple minded bullshit 1) Nada did a standard cheese. This doesn't say much at all. This doesn't say nada was good. This doesn't say nada was bad. I will admit, the cheese had that "nada timing" to it, but nothing else much 2) Nada made a single excellent decision early game: the choice to perform the 7 marine + tank + vulture rush after he saw the fast CC. This decision alone was the only truly "brilliant" move that nada pulled during the game. After that crushing blow, nada simply played solidly and aggressively for the remainder of the game 3) Casy got a bit screwed by Nada's excellent micro early on. Despite being hammered in the face for the rest of the game, numerous key decisions in the last several minutes of the game pulled a brilliant comeback by Casy. Nada didn't exactly make any mistakes, Casy just made vastly superior decisions. For example, Casy opted to sack his natural expansion (his only running expansion) for the opportunity to drop both of Nada's running expos w/ 4 gollies. This was the final, brilliant finishing blow. 4) As Orome stated perfectly, I've never seen such a high level TvT outclassing before. Everything about Casy's play dynamic was exceptional. He demonstrated how sick, well timed aggression can not only win at key moments, but also (assuming you haven't won already) provide excellent opportunities to gain map control and expand. A good example of how casy was controlling nada: Casy built turrets at various spots throughout the map. Casy forced Nada to put his army in various places so precisely that Nada never had the opportunity to kill 1 or 2 lone turrets nearby his main in the center of the map. Pulling any terran player, let alone nada, around like that is a hallmark of a superior player 5) Nada made several solid, consistent decisions which won him this game: he continuously dropped and placed tanks effectively at the @3 natural, negating Casy's midgame expansion opportunities. Moreover, Nada had his classic sick macro throughout the game. Nonetheless, Casy relied on finesseful moves and abusing the center position in odd ways to put pressure on Nada in the early-midgame. Again, we saw in this game how effectively Casy can force his opponent's army to be where he wants it. Had Casy secured the @3 expansion a tad sooner, he would have smashed Nada. Again, we saw very well in the last 3 games the kind of TvT Casy can perform: He knows exactly how and when to attack to force his opponents play. In the first two games, Nada made such well timed/chosen early game attacks, that we didn't get to see Casy shine. In the last game, Casy worked his magic, but couldn't outmacro Nada on 5 gas vs himself on 3. Therefore, although Nada won the series, I feel that Casy is the stronger player. "better players win" my ass. Ever heard of Silver? EAT IT HOT BID
you say shit like casy got screwed by nada's micro.. what the fuck. Credit to nada for playing well? Nope.
Look I can play this game too.
Game 4, BO win. Early facts > early CC.. nada defended best possible but lost way too many scv's and could never mount any agression.
I admire Casy's play, it's entertaining. But to say it's BETTER, not a chance - as we just witnessed.
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You underestimate game 4's really solid build. Casy went in for that 1 vulture advantage and did SO much with it. 1 vulture, 2 marine = 5+ scv kills.... all off 1 rax, 1 fact.
Which he followed up with starport to increase damage while catching up expo and then slowly controlling map. Even the vultures and the mines, while the attack failed miseraby, controlled the map with mines.
His break out of Nada's mines and preventing Nada's map control was another huge aspect. That's already within the game's first 7 minutes.
I'm not in a mood to argue, but the way I see it, I would still re-bet all my liquibet points, and I would still lose another $100 dollars on Casy. It was a bad beat, a suck out.
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Orome says : ''Game 1 was a build order win. Game 2 was dominant, but Casy was playing badly. In game 4, Nada was playing well, that's what made Casy's domination impressive.''
Orome who are u to decide if NaDa played well in game 4 and Casy sucked in game 1 and 2 ? Seriously !? The difference between the 4 games were, that in game 1 and 2 NaDa strategy ( yes STRATEGY) was just much better and perfectly outplayed Casy. So i wouldnt say Casy was any bad but Nadas strategy and execution was just too good and Casy couldnt have done anything against it, really. Game 4 was indeed amazing by Casy and i was truly stunned , but on the other hand NaDa didnt do much at all got early pressure with Wraiths, lost many stuff and in the end just played weaker. And didnt play as well.
So just lets face it : Nada and Casy are both amazing T's and pretty good at TvT. No one can really say who has the better micro/strategy/macro because u would need to analyze the replay to know that, because i.e. in game 4 Casy had much more units which doesnt neceserily have to do something with macro but with advantage due to strategic moves..
So in the end : BOth played amazing both would have deserved it and in the end nada won. So for me the winner of this match is also the better player. At least in this bo5, otherwise the world would be a disc. But oh well..
So u said i got fanboyish and too emotional. So again the question arises : Are u some kind of magician who can see me now typing this ? DO you have any clue which expression im having on my face while writing this ? Do you really think i get angry or mad if someone writes an other opinion than i do ? Im not emotional at all, i m just stating some opinions.
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ok, no problem if Nada stays 9 rank on PR or drops off the list after this awful serie which he undeservedly won. Wins don't count anyways. All was luck, imba maps, cheese and opponent don't playing as usual. For me I know where Nada must be - number two. K10x
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On February 14 2007 05:09 SuperJongMan wrote: You underestimate game 4's really solid build. Casy went in for that 1 vulture advantage and did SO much with it. 1 vulture, 2 marine = 5+ scv kills.... all off 1 rax, 1 fact.
Which he followed up with starport to increase damage while catching up expo and then slowly controlling map. Even the vultures and the mines, while the attack failed miseraby, controlled the map with mines.
His break out of Nada's mines and preventing Nada's map control was another huge aspect. That's already within the game's first 7 minutes.
I'm not in a mood to argue, but the way I see it, I would still re-bet all my liquibet points, and I would still lose another $100 dollars on Casy. It was a bad beat, a suck out.
A bad beat. Lol lets just see the facts and nothing else OK !? Objectivity nothing else..
game 1 : Nada wins clearly game 2 : Nada wins clearly game 3 : Casy wins close game 4 : Casy wíns clearly game 5 : Nada wins close ( could even argue about it being clearly)
Everything else : Strategy, macro, micro, decision making, luck, bad luck, state of mind, coolness, teeth is JUST PURE subjetivity and bias.
So i simply say : NaDa won. Deserved it and Casy lost, but could have won, as well. Casy isnt the worse player, but in this bo5 NaDa was the better and won.
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the question is whether savior will make all this irrelevent or not
nada was so close to beating savior on arkanoid in the superfight, and the other maps are very pro-terran. who will win?
(obviously i am giving iris 0% odds of winning)
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If Nada plays a respectable series against Savior, he's definitely #2.
Stop being bitter and twisting things.
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What are you talking about? This OSL is all Iris. CJ! CJ! CJ!
CJ HWAITING.
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On February 14 2007 05:14 Orome wrote: If Nada plays a respectable series against Savior, he's definitely #2.
Stop being bitter and twisting things.
Art Out of your mouth the sentence : Stop being bitter and twisting things. Im really laughing my ass of right now. The guy who says Casy was better, NaDa was lucky, Casy deserved to win. Casy understand TvT better than Nada, THe guy who said Nadas strategic skills are bad compared to casys, the guy who basicaly cant accept NaDa > Casy in this series and almost pretends as if Casy won the series says this sentence. This is pure sarcasm i guess..
^^
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LOL . I can imagine what will happen if NaDa wins Saviour in the final.
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
In the last game, Casy worked his magic, but couldn't outmacro Nada on 5 gas vs himself on 3
You say this as if the fates themselves conspired to put Nada on 5 gas to start off with and Casy 3. Who do you think was responsible for NaDa holding onto 5 gas while Casy only had 3?
Honestly, all of you guys are being blinded by fanboyism. Not just MagicPhil, but Orome and Day too. Casy won 2/3 of the games that made it to midlate game, but that's only because he sucked hard in game 2 and couldn't even make it to a level midgame. NaDa won 2/3 of his games based on his early aggression, something that only proves that he is a better microer and simply better decisionmaker early game. And please don't say "Well NaDa won game 2 only because Casy sucked, and Casy won game 4 when Nada played well." That sounds like something out of the mouth of a shitty USEast pub.
NaDa played better game 1 & 2 (Casy definitely could have defended better game 1 and microed better game 2); Casy played better game 3 & 4; NaDa played better game 5. That's all there is to it. Drawing comparisons between games and extrapolating performances is silly and meaningless. Especially in TvT, where minute little things have such huge ramifications later in the game, it's hard to compare these performances and you can twist it any way you want and provide a million different interpretations.
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On February 14 2007 05:11 MaGic~PhiL wrote: So u said i got fanboyish and too emotional. So again the question arises : Are u some kind of magician who can see me now typing this ? DO you have any clue which expression im having on my face while writing this ? Do you really think i get angry or mad if someone writes an other opinion than i do ? Im not emotional at all, i m just stating some opinions.
Read your posts on the last few pages again, you get sarcastic, instead of arguing back you start to exaggerate what I'm saying.
Anyway, I'm through arguing with you, you do not even make an effort to actually argue about the games in detail, your argument is confined mostly to 'Nada won, so he must be the better player'.
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If you are gonna argue, do it straight and don't attack the character or distort things. Think of what the PR is, how players are ranked, and why his statement that Nada can become #2 is not stupid given his information.
There are so many thoughts in between you are missing just to slam the dude...
I believe in forum language they call it trolling or ogreing or somethign and it's considered assinine.
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If NaDa wins vs Savior in the finals , then it was Savior wanting to put NaDa at 4 OSL titles, because they are good buddies, after all..
PhiL edit : 2000 D:
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Valhalla18444 Posts
On February 14 2007 05:16 MaGic~PhiL wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 05:14 Orome wrote: If Nada plays a respectable series against Savior, he's definitely #2.
Stop being bitter and twisting things. Art Out of your mouth the sentence : Stop being bitter and twisting things. Im really laughing my ass of right now. The guy who says Casy was better, NaDa was lucky, Casy deserved to win. Casy understand TvT better than Nada, THe guy who said Nadas strategic skills are bad compared to casys, the guy who basicaly cant accept NaDa > Casy in this series and almost pretends as if Casy won the series says this sentence. This is pure sarcasm i guess.. ^^
....Casy IS better at TvT
this was a great series but he's pretty much right, Nada got build order lucky on Arkanoid in game 1, outmicrod Casy in game 2 with a surprise attack. Game 3, Casy made the most of a dire situation and pulled out a win through overall superior play. Game 4, Casy absolutely destroyed Nada in every sense of the word. Game 5 was a close battle, but Casy is not as good at expo timing on Arkanoid as Nada is.
It's completely fair to say that Nada's win was made easier by having Arkanoid twice, and its completely fair to say Casy's TvT is better, because it is. Both players played exceedingly well in this series, but that doesn't make certain truths untrue.
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Nada >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Casy in every aspect.
1. achievement 2. skill 3. looks ( Not sure about this one actually) 4. teeth 5. height 6. number of fans 7. salary 8. personality 9. sex
Losers remain silent.
FIN
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NADA WE LOVE YOU! I NEVER DOUBT ABOUT YOUR WIN!!
But... please! Next time do 3-0... and don't give me a heartattack 3-2 T.T!
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On February 14 2007 05:18 mdb wrote: LOL . I can imagine what will happen if NaDa wins Saviour in the final. He'll have 4 badges.
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Valhalla18444 Posts
On February 14 2007 05:22 1tym wrote: 4. teeth 5. height
hahahaha
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On February 14 2007 05:22 1tym wrote: Nada >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Casy in every aspect.
1. achievement 2. skill 3. looks ( Not sure about this one actually) 4. teeth 5. height 6. number of fans 7. salary 8. personality 9. sex
Losers remain silent.
FIN
Hahaha, Casy fans got owned T.T #2 is arguable, but at best, we win 2 out of 9 -_-;;
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
On February 14 2007 05:22 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 05:16 MaGic~PhiL wrote:On February 14 2007 05:14 Orome wrote: If Nada plays a respectable series against Savior, he's definitely #2.
Stop being bitter and twisting things. Art Out of your mouth the sentence : Stop being bitter and twisting things. Im really laughing my ass of right now. The guy who says Casy was better, NaDa was lucky, Casy deserved to win. Casy understand TvT better than Nada, THe guy who said Nadas strategic skills are bad compared to casys, the guy who basicaly cant accept NaDa > Casy in this series and almost pretends as if Casy won the series says this sentence. This is pure sarcasm i guess.. ^^ ....Casy IS better at TvT this was a great series but he's pretty much right, Nada got build order lucky on Arkanoid in game 1, outmicrod Casy in game 2 with a surprise attack. Game 3, Casy made the most of a dire situation and pulled out a win through overall superior play. Game 4, Casy absolutely destroyed Nada in every sense of the word. Game 5 was a close battle, but Casy is not as good at expo timing on Arkanoid as Nada is. It's completely fair to say that Nada's win was made easier by having Arkanoid twice, and its completely fair to say Casy's TvT is better, because it is. Both players played exceedingly well in this series, but that doesn't make certain truths untrue.
The ability to end a game quickly shouldn't reflect poorly upon a person's TvT skill.
Maybe you can say that Casy's TvT appeared to be more impressive than that of NaDa's, but there is no real basis to say that Casy's TvT is better based on today's games - and a little unfair to NaDa, who after all won the TvT series.
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Hey Orome i never said NaDa is the better player. But NaDa was just the better player in this bo5 series otherwise he obviously wouldnt have won, would he ?
And i dont really care , if NaDa won it or if Casy lost it , because u can always say it wasnt the skills of the guy who won, but the faults of the guy who lost. If just find it ridicolous that u basicaly say im not bringing any facts, while you are making statements which are just totally unproven and strange..
Like saying Casy understand TvT better than NaDa ( plz explain me how u come to that conclusion)
Nadas strategic skills are not as good as Cas'ys ( plz explain me how u come to that conclusion)
I will stop posting any sarcastic statements as soon as u provide me with answer that at least show some contet of truth, because i know u cant really answer these statements , because they are simply not true and IF , then no one could ever now except god.
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Canada9720 Posts
Agreed with GI's post, also, it's absurd to say that one player was lucky to draw a particular map in a mirror matchup. The implied advantage here stems not from luck, but from skill if this map played such a decisive role.
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honestly throughout the match, i thought casy played better.. decision wise.. da positioning of tanks an timing of attacks.. seriously u cant argue with that.. nada's initial swarm of wraiths didn even touch casy's dropships until they finished unloading all the units.. (i'm talking about the final match here..) but in the end, nada proves why it is him that is worthy of being in the final.. i know most of you think casy's strategy was better but there goes a saying, "good offence wins the crowd, while good defence wins the game.." so yea.. hardluck casy.. you were my favourite terran pgmer by far this season but better luck next time i guess..
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On February 14 2007 05:29 CTStalker wrote: Agreed with GI's post, also, it's absurd to say that one player was lucky to draw a particular map in a mirror matchup. The implied advantage here stems not from luck, but from skill if this map played such a decisive role.
If Federer played Nadal on a randomly chosen surface, would Nadal not be lucky if sand was the picked one?
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Do you guys pronounce Casy as K C or cassie?
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Hong Kong20321 Posts
On February 14 2007 05:33 1tym wrote: Do you guys pronounce Casy as K C or cassie?
kc. like casey. haha. like..case-ee.
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On February 14 2007 05:29 CTStalker wrote: Agreed with GI's post, also, it's absurd to say that one player was lucky to draw a particular map in a mirror matchup. The implied advantage here stems not from luck, but from skill if this map played such a decisive role.
Style. Even mirrors have style. Certain maps bring out the best in certain players. Arkanoid, as we all know, is a very slow map. There are buildings in the way, lots of terrain that is easily and passively defended, many easy siege and stay spots, and despite that, Casy managed to exploit the terrain to his style, and was that cross wall siege a cool arkanoid first or what? Even after 2 seasons, I'm glad the semis showed me a new trick on Arkanoid, even though the map sucks.
The map had more to offer a player like Nada than Casy.
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On February 14 2007 05:16 MaGic~PhiL wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 05:14 Orome wrote: If Nada plays a respectable series against Savior, he's definitely #2.
Stop being bitter and twisting things. Art Out of your mouth the sentence : Stop being bitter and twisting things. Im really laughing my ass of right now. The guy who says Casy was better, NaDa was lucky, Casy deserved to win. Casy understand TvT better than Nada, THe guy who said Nadas strategic skills are bad compared to casys, the guy who basicaly cant accept NaDa > Casy in this series and almost pretends as if Casy won the series says this sentence. This is pure sarcasm i guess.. ^^ Orome occasionally makes some bad statements. It's all a part of being young and 17, or something like that. But I think we can all admit that most of us are hypocrites and say things out of frustration or fanaticism.
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
On February 14 2007 05:33 Orome wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 05:29 CTStalker wrote: Agreed with GI's post, also, it's absurd to say that one player was lucky to draw a particular map in a mirror matchup. The implied advantage here stems not from luck, but from skill if this map played such a decisive role. If Federer played Nadal on a randomly chosen surface, would Nadal not be lucky if sand was the picked one?
It's clay, not sand; moreover, Federer and Nadal's styles are so different that it is as if they are playing different Starcraft races. Casy and NaDa's styles differ in very small aspects; overall, they still build tanks and goliaths and vultures. Federer and Nadal is like the difference between GoRush and Boxer - two completely different players that the map/surface affects in two different ways.
The analogy might hold if you asked what would it be like if Nadal played Moya on clay or grass; but in that situation, it is still much more the player than the surface.
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Now we just need Savior to win to set up the dream final.
Better than Boxer vs Yellow.
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Federer and Nadal do fores and backs. -_-;; Bad analogy.
I try to understand my point, but I think you do not understand the impact maps have on stylistic players, especially such a strong defensive map like Arkanoid, obviously, favors a more defensive player.
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dream final would be neo boxer vs savior. Savior will eat NaDa for dinner -,-
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Oh, and people should stop arguing about who has better TvT skill.
NaDa won. Losers have no words to say. The only things that are possible are past statistics or excuses or placing the blame on "luck". The winner only has to state: "I have won. That is final."
GG NaDa
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On February 14 2007 05:35 GrandInquisitor wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 05:33 Orome wrote:On February 14 2007 05:29 CTStalker wrote: Agreed with GI's post, also, it's absurd to say that one player was lucky to draw a particular map in a mirror matchup. The implied advantage here stems not from luck, but from skill if this map played such a decisive role. If Federer played Nadal on a randomly chosen surface, would Nadal not be lucky if sand was the picked one? It's clay, not sand; moreover, Federer and Nadal's styles are so different that it is as if they are playing different Starcraft races. Casy and NaDa's styles differ in very small aspects; overall, they still build tanks and goliaths and vultures. Federer and Nadal is like the difference between GoRush and Boxer - two completely different players that the map/surface affects in two different ways. The analogy might hold if you asked what would it be like if Nadal played Moya on clay or grass; but in that situation, it is still much more the player than the surface.
Casy's and Nada's styles differ a lot. If you don't realize that, I don't think you can talk. Aren't you the one who's never watched a live game or vod?
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Nada played better TvT in this Bo5 Series? He won, so i think we can answer YES
Nada played better TvT than Casy overall? We cant say that today.
But what matters is to win when it is important. THAT is great champions's trademark. Nada sure is a great champion and i hope Casy will too.
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
On February 14 2007 05:37 SuperJongMan wrote: Federer and Nadal do fores and backs. -_-;; Bad analogy.
I try to understand my point, but I think you do not understand the impact maps have on stylistic players, especially such a strong defensive map like Arkanoid, obviously, favors a more defensive player.
And Boxer and GoRush both build workers. They're called the same thing but are in reality completely different. Federer slices and wants his balls to skid on the slippery grass; Nadal relies on topspin and wants his balls to bite into the tough clay and pop up.
Just as there are 3 styles of Starcraft play (T, P, Z) and substyles within each (Tornado Terran, Sauron Zerg), there are 3 main styles of tennis play (baseline, allaround, and serve/volley) and substyles within each (slice serve/volley style, big serve baseline). Maps and surfaces affect the main styles to a huge degree; but substyles much less so.
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On February 14 2007 05:35 WhatisProtoss wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 05:16 MaGic~PhiL wrote:On February 14 2007 05:14 Orome wrote: If Nada plays a respectable series against Savior, he's definitely #2.
Stop being bitter and twisting things. Art Out of your mouth the sentence : Stop being bitter and twisting things. Im really laughing my ass of right now. The guy who says Casy was better, NaDa was lucky, Casy deserved to win. Casy understand TvT better than Nada, THe guy who said Nadas strategic skills are bad compared to casys, the guy who basicaly cant accept NaDa > Casy in this series and almost pretends as if Casy won the series says this sentence. This is pure sarcasm i guess.. ^^ Orome occasionally makes some bad statements. It's all a part of being young and 17, or something like that. But I think we can all admit that most of us are hypocrites and say things out of frustration or fanaticism.
Is this just intended to be a personal attack on me? You might notice I'm not alone with my opinion, and that the people who know what they're talking about, Day and Steve, agree with me.
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
On February 14 2007 05:38 Orome wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 05:35 GrandInquisitor wrote:On February 14 2007 05:33 Orome wrote:On February 14 2007 05:29 CTStalker wrote: Agreed with GI's post, also, it's absurd to say that one player was lucky to draw a particular map in a mirror matchup. The implied advantage here stems not from luck, but from skill if this map played such a decisive role. If Federer played Nadal on a randomly chosen surface, would Nadal not be lucky if sand was the picked one? It's clay, not sand; moreover, Federer and Nadal's styles are so different that it is as if they are playing different Starcraft races. Casy and NaDa's styles differ in very small aspects; overall, they still build tanks and goliaths and vultures. Federer and Nadal is like the difference between GoRush and Boxer - two completely different players that the map/surface affects in two different ways. The analogy might hold if you asked what would it be like if Nadal played Moya on clay or grass; but in that situation, it is still much more the player than the surface. Casy's and Nada's styles differ a lot. If you don't realize that, I don't think you can talk. Aren't you the one who's never watched a live game or vod?
Is this just intended to be a personal attack on me? I watched today's games, and was under the impression we were talking about whose TvT was better today as opposed to historically.
And honestly, you think the difference between casy and nada is comparable to the difference between federer and nadal?
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It is amazing how accurate this article is. I don't understand how people can sit here and still flat out rant that Casy is the better player. Casy knows NaDa's playing style. Hell everyone knows NaDa's playing style. This is the same forum that complained when NaDa beat UpMagic because everyone thought that NaDa can only win based off of cheese wins and no strong play. However, Casy (the stronger player?) could not adjust and adapt to play against NaDa's style. How does this constitute the praise of everyone and the overlooking of NaDa's achievements once again?
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On February 14 2007 05:42 GrandInquisitor wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 05:38 Orome wrote:On February 14 2007 05:35 GrandInquisitor wrote:On February 14 2007 05:33 Orome wrote:On February 14 2007 05:29 CTStalker wrote: Agreed with GI's post, also, it's absurd to say that one player was lucky to draw a particular map in a mirror matchup. The implied advantage here stems not from luck, but from skill if this map played such a decisive role. If Federer played Nadal on a randomly chosen surface, would Nadal not be lucky if sand was the picked one? It's clay, not sand; moreover, Federer and Nadal's styles are so different that it is as if they are playing different Starcraft races. Casy and NaDa's styles differ in very small aspects; overall, they still build tanks and goliaths and vultures. Federer and Nadal is like the difference between GoRush and Boxer - two completely different players that the map/surface affects in two different ways. The analogy might hold if you asked what would it be like if Nadal played Moya on clay or grass; but in that situation, it is still much more the player than the surface. Casy's and Nada's styles differ a lot. If you don't realize that, I don't think you can talk. Aren't you the one who's never watched a live game or vod? Is this just intended to be a personal attack on me? I watched today's games, and was under the impression we were talking about whose TvT was better today as opposed to historically. And honestly, you think the difference between casy and nada is comparable to the difference between federer and nadal?
Not quite as big, but big enough for Arkanoid twice to favour Nada.
Edit: I'm not blaming Arkanoid twice for Casy's loss btw.
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If this series showed one thing, then that both players are on a pretty even level in tvt, it could have gone both ways ... This was a great series, tvt gods battling it out. Nada maybe showed a tad more experience or sense for winning.
Both would have been worthy opponents for savior.
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
On February 14 2007 05:45 Orome wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 05:42 GrandInquisitor wrote:On February 14 2007 05:38 Orome wrote:On February 14 2007 05:35 GrandInquisitor wrote:On February 14 2007 05:33 Orome wrote:On February 14 2007 05:29 CTStalker wrote: Agreed with GI's post, also, it's absurd to say that one player was lucky to draw a particular map in a mirror matchup. The implied advantage here stems not from luck, but from skill if this map played such a decisive role. If Federer played Nadal on a randomly chosen surface, would Nadal not be lucky if sand was the picked one? It's clay, not sand; moreover, Federer and Nadal's styles are so different that it is as if they are playing different Starcraft races. Casy and NaDa's styles differ in very small aspects; overall, they still build tanks and goliaths and vultures. Federer and Nadal is like the difference between GoRush and Boxer - two completely different players that the map/surface affects in two different ways. The analogy might hold if you asked what would it be like if Nadal played Moya on clay or grass; but in that situation, it is still much more the player than the surface. Casy's and Nada's styles differ a lot. If you don't realize that, I don't think you can talk. Aren't you the one who's never watched a live game or vod? Is this just intended to be a personal attack on me? I watched today's games, and was under the impression we were talking about whose TvT was better today as opposed to historically. And honestly, you think the difference between casy and nada is comparable to the difference between federer and nadal? Not quite as big, but big enough for Arkanoid twice to favour Nada.
The hallmark of a good player is being able to adapt in the face of pressure. Moreover, only NaDa's game 5 victory is directly attributable to the map. Casy went 2-2 otherwise, so it's hard to argue that adjusting for Arkanoid results in Casy playing better TvT than NaDa.
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On February 14 2007 05:49 GrandInquisitor wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 05:45 Orome wrote:On February 14 2007 05:42 GrandInquisitor wrote:On February 14 2007 05:38 Orome wrote:On February 14 2007 05:35 GrandInquisitor wrote:On February 14 2007 05:33 Orome wrote:On February 14 2007 05:29 CTStalker wrote: Agreed with GI's post, also, it's absurd to say that one player was lucky to draw a particular map in a mirror matchup. The implied advantage here stems not from luck, but from skill if this map played such a decisive role. If Federer played Nadal on a randomly chosen surface, would Nadal not be lucky if sand was the picked one? It's clay, not sand; moreover, Federer and Nadal's styles are so different that it is as if they are playing different Starcraft races. Casy and NaDa's styles differ in very small aspects; overall, they still build tanks and goliaths and vultures. Federer and Nadal is like the difference between GoRush and Boxer - two completely different players that the map/surface affects in two different ways. The analogy might hold if you asked what would it be like if Nadal played Moya on clay or grass; but in that situation, it is still much more the player than the surface. Casy's and Nada's styles differ a lot. If you don't realize that, I don't think you can talk. Aren't you the one who's never watched a live game or vod? Is this just intended to be a personal attack on me? I watched today's games, and was under the impression we were talking about whose TvT was better today as opposed to historically. And honestly, you think the difference between casy and nada is comparable to the difference between federer and nadal? Not quite as big, but big enough for Arkanoid twice to favour Nada. The hallmark of a good player is being able to adapt in the face of pressure. Moreover, only NaDa's game 5 victory is directly attributable to the map. Casy went 2-2 otherwise, so it's hard to argue that adjusting for Arkanoid results in Casy playing better TvT than NaDa. Be careful, dude. You're probably making a personal attack on this kid. Let's try not to hurt his feelings.
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On February 14 2007 05:49 GrandInquisitor wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 05:45 Orome wrote:On February 14 2007 05:42 GrandInquisitor wrote:On February 14 2007 05:38 Orome wrote:On February 14 2007 05:35 GrandInquisitor wrote:On February 14 2007 05:33 Orome wrote:On February 14 2007 05:29 CTStalker wrote: Agreed with GI's post, also, it's absurd to say that one player was lucky to draw a particular map in a mirror matchup. The implied advantage here stems not from luck, but from skill if this map played such a decisive role. If Federer played Nadal on a randomly chosen surface, would Nadal not be lucky if sand was the picked one? It's clay, not sand; moreover, Federer and Nadal's styles are so different that it is as if they are playing different Starcraft races. Casy and NaDa's styles differ in very small aspects; overall, they still build tanks and goliaths and vultures. Federer and Nadal is like the difference between GoRush and Boxer - two completely different players that the map/surface affects in two different ways. The analogy might hold if you asked what would it be like if Nadal played Moya on clay or grass; but in that situation, it is still much more the player than the surface. Casy's and Nada's styles differ a lot. If you don't realize that, I don't think you can talk. Aren't you the one who's never watched a live game or vod? Is this just intended to be a personal attack on me? I watched today's games, and was under the impression we were talking about whose TvT was better today as opposed to historically. And honestly, you think the difference between casy and nada is comparable to the difference between federer and nadal? Not quite as big, but big enough for Arkanoid twice to favour Nada. The hallmark of a good player is being able to adapt in the face of pressure. Moreover, only NaDa's game 5 victory is directly attributable to the map. Casy went 2-2 otherwise, so it's hard to argue that adjusting for Arkanoid results in Casy playing better TvT than NaDa.
To be honest, I'm not sure what you mean. How about we just drop it?
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Lets just drop it and accept the truth : Nada won this series We dont know who is the better TvT player but this day NaDa came out on top
Everything else is objetivity and has nothing to do with the truth and is everyones own bias. If you liked Casys play better its your very own right and now one can disagree but u can never say Casy was better or NaDa didnt deserve it.
U cant say NaDas strategic skills are worse, because thats just not true and we cant really know.
I dont want to start things up again, but Orome there are still those two statements of you which i asked u to explain to me.. u didnt, but instead u posted some funny phrase..
Quite funny again, after reminding me of your ''emotion phil'' / '' cant discuss properly'' stuff
: )
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Braavos36362 Posts
On February 14 2007 05:22 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 05:16 MaGic~PhiL wrote:On February 14 2007 05:14 Orome wrote: If Nada plays a respectable series against Savior, he's definitely #2.
Stop being bitter and twisting things. Art Out of your mouth the sentence : Stop being bitter and twisting things. Im really laughing my ass of right now. The guy who says Casy was better, NaDa was lucky, Casy deserved to win. Casy understand TvT better than Nada, THe guy who said Nadas strategic skills are bad compared to casys, the guy who basicaly cant accept NaDa > Casy in this series and almost pretends as if Casy won the series says this sentence. This is pure sarcasm i guess.. ^^ ....Casy IS better at TvT this was a great series but he's pretty much right, Nada got build order lucky on Arkanoid in game 1, outmicrod Casy in game 2 with a surprise attack. Game 3, Casy made the most of a dire situation and pulled out a win through overall superior play. Game 4, Casy absolutely destroyed Nada in every sense of the word. Game 5 was a close battle, but Casy is not as good at expo timing on Arkanoid as Nada is. It's completely fair to say that Nada's win was made easier by having Arkanoid twice, and its completely fair to say Casy's TvT is better, because it is. Both players played exceedingly well in this series, but that doesn't make certain truths untrue. you see "build order lucky" and i see decisiveness in predicting what his opponent will do. even if nada didn't go to the right spot right away, he had 1 scan and going to the second spot would've still killed casy. it's not luck, its a champion who takes calculated risks and anticipates well.
my point is this: many see casy's game 4 win as more "impressive" than let's say nada's game 2, but when you break it down:
Game 2: 1 absolutely decisive and crucial early game decision/execution by nada Game 4: 50 little mid/late game correct decisions and executions by casy
now its just a viewpoint, some people would see game 4 as more "impressive" than game 2, maybe even see casy as the better TvT player with a better understanding of the matchup, but what i see is someone (nada) who made one correct important decision/execution when it mattered and someone else (casy) who was unable to under pressure (in game 2).
i see both those games as equal in demonstrating which player was better, and that's why i don't understand why some people are all freaking out about casy's game 4 but conveniently forget that he made his fast expo cc right in front of fucking nada's scouting scv in game 2 which basically allowed nada to rush him. game 2 was the less flashy, easy, nada-style decision and win, but i don't see how it should be held in any less esteem. these games really show how the different styles of the two players can be interpreted and how you as a viewer have your own personal scale of judging "better."
when you boil starcraft down its just a giant string of tiny decisions, micro executions, etc, and what does it matter if casy made 6000 awesome moves in game 4 when they are all nullified by 1 great move by nada in game 2? they both led to victory and one player's way should not be viewed as inferior.
that is why i think nada was the superior player in this series. casy can be 10x the strategist or have 10x the understanding of TvT than Nada does (i don't think this is the case) but if he fucks up early game like he did in game 2 or has inferior macro or expansion timing in game 5, nobody cares because it was a losing effort by him.
impressive in a losing effort (in a mirror matchup) is just that: impressive, but inferior.
edit: and to all those saying "omg nada got arkanoid twice imba" that's just ridiculous, nada is better at multitasking on a map like that, just because casy isn't good at it doesn't make nada "lucky" it just makes casy inferior
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and now after these wise words we all SJLIG
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FOR ALL WHO DID NOT SEE THE GAMES, THE GAMES ARE CURRENTLY ON OGN STREAM! (VODS)
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Russian Federation1953 Posts
Just read what those Casy fanboys use to describe Casy:
"brilliant, fantastic, unbelieveble, godly, the best" etc.
And NaDa is only:
"lucky, good microer, solid" etc.
And when you bringing Federer vs Nadal analogy it is clear that FEDERER=NADA and Casy is Nadal because NaDa has achieved in SC what Federer in tennis. NaDa=3 OSL, numerous KPGA and MSL titles, KT-KTF champ and Casy who has 1 OSL title
WHO IS FUCKING FEDERER HERE?
Casy was never good TvTer while NaDa was the best TvTer long before Casy went professional (NaDa beat BoxeR constantly and Casy is just BoxeR's copycat - hell, he even looks like Boxer)
Orome, I really don't understand why your name is in blue. You are below average tl.net member judging by how you act in this thread
NaDa is clearly better player than Casy and today he proved it
NaDa = pocket Aces and Casy = pocket Jacks
GG
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I think is just plain stupid to say that Nada won thanks to Arkanoid being played twice. So what if Arkanoid is the defensive map (I'm not saing it is). We all saw Nada's play on Arkanoid against Sea.Up where HE was the aggressive one. Nada can be defensive or aggressive, depending on the map. It's not like Casy said to himself "Ok, it's better to play defensive on Arkanoid, and just expand, but that's not my style. I'm just going to play like i play on any other map, and lose." Casy knows the map as good as Nada and he still choosed to play aggresivly and lost.
If Casy played on an island map aginst Nada, would he be making vultures and reaserching mines, and then say at the end, when he lost, that it was due to the fact that his style is not good for that map. I mean, come on people.
p.s. I think Nada could have won on RLT.
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IF I may add something, tho it is subjective opinion. I really have to say what is on my mind
About game 4.
You all talk how Casy outclassed NaDa, but this game is also BO win. Yes, Casy dominated that match, sure. But NaDa was fucked after Casy`s first vulture attack, where NaDa had to defend with scv`s. NaDa was clearly very behind from that point of game, especially after initial wraith attack, which hurt his eco big time. With no damaged eco, and while taking map it wasn`t really that hard for Casy to win that game. Even tho NaDa was is such a bad position, he was able to defend quite well against Casy`s superior army multiple times. He just couldn`t handle Casy`s big eco.
Overall I am more impressed with NaDa. The series could have finished 3-0 in his favor anyways. Not taking away anything from Casy here. He played great, but NaDa was better today. You have to admit that.
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I prefer the system where in the last game every player is removing one of the maps and then a lot decides the last map from the 2 left
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ilovecats
United States265 Posts
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thanks NaDa im studying happy today :D. Very goods games and it could be 3:0. Since i know about PROs NaDa is the one who can make a good games with new-old school gamers,others like yellow, the marine, boxer, chojja etc were simply losing their opportunities for the win (sorry, im studying english recently)
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I think Nada definitely played better overall, and especially in game 5. Finding a way to deflect the pressure on his northern expo while simultaneously taking more exps along the left side of the map AND denying Casy an exp along the right was quite impressive from Nada.
After almost being a blowout, the series turned out quite nicely. Voted Casy but props to Nada and GL vs. Savior in the finals (Iris, lol).
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Damn, i hate so much Nada i cheered for Casy today and he lost.
Too many Nada fanboys here, he should have lost in group stages (a bit like Casy last year) and now, unless Iris qualifies, he almost won this OSL (Savior has very little chance considering the maps).
Nada makes OSL boring
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Braavos36362 Posts
"savior has very little chance"
yeah ok
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Well, yeah he was lucky against Midas, let's admit it. RLT and Longinus are really hurting him. On HH and Arkanoid, i'll put him over Nada. But this is definitely hard. And Osl history proves it too much, zergs stands almost no chances against terrans in those kind of situation.
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On February 14 2007 07:29 Wasabi wrote: gah, nada just can't stop winning. As I've said before I like Nada, but stilll I would've opted for a Casy vs. Savior finals.
P/S: The concept of gaming history DO NOT work on Savior.
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I think the games showed Nada and Casy are very close in skill.
It's certainly a bit rich to say Casy is better...
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I think he wanted to quote the guy above you.^^
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There is no point saying that CASY should have won with cute manuevers like tank placement and drop holds if he lost the series. Tactics and insight like that useful to have in certain maps and situations but it doesnt make you a better player than someone who can stronger fundamentals in macro and micro like NADA CONSISTENTLY showed in this series. In game 3 with that crazy comeback and game 4, where Casy essentially murdered Nada with that style, it shone through, but where were his strengths in 1 2 and 5 and why didnt it save him?
Its a BO5 in an OSL SEMIFINAL. They both HAD to win, no punches were pulled, and ultimately Nada showed that his preparation and conditioning were superior to Casy's, at least this series. Its too bad though, a Casy vs Savior final would have been spectacular -_______-;;.
oh btw, this is going to be a nasty final for Nada
TvT vs Iris? God.
TvZ vs Savior? Good God.
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On February 14 2007 08:04 Wasabi wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 07:41 Ash wrote:On February 14 2007 07:29 Wasabi wrote: gah, nada just can't stop winning. As I've said before I like Nada, but stilll I would've opted for a Casy vs. Savior finals. P/S: The concept of gaming history DO NOT work on Savior. uh... what? random comment? this has nothing to do with the upcoming nada vs. savior fight.
sorry i was referring to this :
On February 14 2007 07:11 ~chut~ wrote: Well, yeah he was lucky against Midas, let's admit it. RLT and Longinus are really hurting him. On HH and Arkanoid, i'll put him over Nada. But this is definitely hard. And Osl history proves it too much, zergs stands almost no chances against terrans in those kind of situation.
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On February 13 2007 18:25 QuietIdiot wrote: casy will fuck him up.
Or Nada will win 3-2 cuz of arkanoid.
I knew itttttttt
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Wow, looks like I missed a great series.
Nada's fucking godly, now we only need Savior to crush Iris (sorry Iris) and we'll have one hell of a final, once again. The guy who's never lost a final yet (Savior) vs the guy who rolled over both his Z opponents during previous finals.
I actually think Nada overwent his little slump *thanks* to the retarded OSL format (he couldn't have done this months ago, after going 0-2), but in the end I'm really glad he did (Casy vs Savior would have sounded awesome, too, though).
By the way, the only guys who beat Nada at TvT recently are hmm, Oov and... Boxer. (I know it's totally different stuff and incomparable, just a fun fact... they were bo1 too so it's also way more random)
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YOU CALLED IT FIRST ELEVEN-ONE
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a NaDa vs SaviOr final would be so crazy
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Hoping savior overcomes the maps to 3-1 Nada again.
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yeah, i really HOPE THAT IRIS DON'T WIN !!!!! NNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
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Savior please 3:0 Nada, I just hate him
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NaDa will beat SaviOr
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u gotta skate8152 Posts
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GOd, I hate savior/nada. Fuck, IRIS PRZ WIN, OR AT LEAST GET 1 fuckin WIN. GESUS.
I wish both of them get 2-2, both die of of exhaustion in the final game, and let casy or iris battle it off for the win. Casy vs Iris final would be FUNNnnnnnnnn
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saw the vods. Tense games.
Nada's TvT is in my opinion better and more solid but casy put up adamn good fight~~!
In the third game I was like "OMFG NADA YOU HAVE 3 BASES WHY DONT YOU JUST DEFEND T.T"
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On February 14 2007 08:23 PoP wrote:By the way, the only guys who beat Nada at TvT recently are hmm, Oov and... Boxer. (I know it's totally different stuff and incomparable, just a fun fact... they were bo1 too so it's also way more random)
Iris' TvT is terrifying. Nada imho will have just as much trouble trying to beat him as savior :'(.
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PoP, Savior lost a MSL final to Chojja, but it's no big deal
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On February 14 2007 08:23 PoP wrote: The guy who's never lost a final yet (Savior) vs the guy who rolled over both his Z opponents during previous finals.
Well Savior did lose one final (msl) to Chojja. Nada on the other hand has never lost ogn final. OMG if there will be Nada vs Savior finals, it is going to be so tense. Can`t wait
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On February 14 2007 09:27 ~chut~ wrote:PoP, Savior lost a MSL final to Chojja, but it's no big deal
I was going to say that
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fuck Nada for ruining the chance of us seeing Casy/Savior final. No one wants to see him get 3-0'd again by Savior
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On February 14 2007 09:27 ~chut~ wrote:PoP, Savior lost a MSL final to Chojja, but it's no big deal
Yeah, dunno why I forgot about it since I was thinking about it like a few days ago. :o
Anyway it's pretty much the only bo5 he's lost, like, ever?
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I read the reports, saw Mani go "gg" on top of p.13 and thought "OK the usual NaDa once again, going 3:0 against even the greatest players".
But then, there were 22 pages left!
Still, nice work NaDa!
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On February 14 2007 09:38 cantpmwhilebanned wrote: fuck Nada for ruining the chance of us seeing Casy/Savior final. No one wants to see him get 3-0'd again by Savior
Again ? did I miss something ? You guys are overestimating Savior, yes he's hot, yes he's currently the best, yes he has the most insane ZvT since the yellow era but it's not like he can 3-0 the best terrans with mouse only. He is dominant, not invulnerable.
But it will be one hell of a challenge for NaDa, even with these maps. It won't go 3-0 either way, I say 3-2 or 2-3 imho
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Everyone is underestimating nada, he's on a mission and the superfight games were a lot closer than people seem to think.
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On February 14 2007 10:37 ChApFoU wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 09:38 cantpmwhilebanned wrote: fuck Nada for ruining the chance of us seeing Casy/Savior final. No one wants to see him get 3-0'd again by Savior Again ? did I miss something ? You guys are overestimating Savior, yes he's hot, yes he's currently the best, yes he has the most insane ZvT since the yellow era but it's not like he can 3-0 the best terrans with mouse only. He is dominant, not invulnerable. But it will be one hell of a challenge for NaDa, even with these maps. It won't go 3-0 either way, I say 3-2 or 2-3 imho i think he was mistakenly referring to superfight where nada lost 1-3. or maybe the finals of one of those chinese tournaments where savior won 2-0.
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u gotta skate8152 Posts
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Holy fuck, I really REALLY can't stand Casy/Savior fanboys. It's sooooo annoying.
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
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Thanks KizZBG! Here's what me thinks will happen:
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In the last game, Casy worked his magic, but couldn't outmacro Nada on 5 gas vs himself on 3. Therefore, although Nada won the series, I feel that Casy is the stronger player.
"better players win" my ass. Ever heard of Silver?
EAT IT HOT BID[/QUOTE]
u say it if it wasnt casys fault that nada had 5 gas and he only 3^^
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"Now will I have sAviOr for breakfast, lunch, or dinner?"
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and wtf how do u know casy doesnt love arkanoid. What if that his fav TvT map in practice games. Fuck that Nada ftw ~
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Netherlands19124 Posts
I swear if Savior wins both finals I'll make some honorary thread just to take the piss out of all the disillusioned fanboys who have been doing nothing for the last year or 2 then going BUT HE'LL WTFPWN SAVIOR HE SUCKS and getting the guy they rooted for owned in a heartbeat afterwards anyway -.-.
Savior plz put nada in his place THANKS! :D
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It is not the truth that better player always wins. Sometimes luck decides winner. I won't say anything about Nada vs Casy except that the series was good. All terrans have great winning chances against Savior in both MSL because maps are really bad for Z. Savior won against Midas was the thought series. Savior won only due to great strategies. He didn't play his standard style because that is not good option in these circumstances. All I want to say is that even if Nada win against Savior in the finals (If Savor passes Iris which is not easy also) that doesn't mean that he is better player. I don't know why map creators are so biased. Does anyone know that? I remembered when Yellow lost vs Boxer in SL final at Neo Hall of Valhalla. He was clearly better player at that moment but still he lost because on Valhalla T >> Z. In the end everyone remember only winners. That is the shame. To conclude if Savior beats all terrans on the such bad maps that is the prove that He is the best player of all time. GoGoGo Savior!
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I only saw game 3. Casy played great but it was evident that he was the underdog fighting to survive kind of like boxer in many games.
I think they should give him some sort of special prize for beautiful playing
BTW Nada vs Savior will probably be great but even if nada somehow win the real winner will still be savior cause in both MSL and OSL the maps were really against him and he advanced in both simultanously. I hope savior will show em anyway ^^
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On February 14 2007 12:19 Byyk wrote: To conclude if Savior beats all terrans on the such bad maps that is the prove that He is the best player of all time. GoGoGo Savior! All-time? You mean all-fucking-time? Maybe 2-3 years later, when Savior takes another 5-6 titles - yeah, but now - NO! And no misunderstandings - I am a Nada fan, but clearly Savior is better nowadays.
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great games , both players played really good
but I wonder why do you all think nada got advantaged with arkanoid twice , you all assume it is his best map since he has a crazy record on it , that doesn't mean he doesn't have better records in TvT on other maps and would have better have a serie with 2 hitchikers or whatever . Nada has always been on of the best tvt players with oov and xellos back in times , I really don't think an other 5th map would have changed anything
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intrigue
Washington, D.C9931 Posts
these games were amazing to watch live. casy's strategic understanding and efficiency with small numbers of units was amazing to watch, but it just didn't cut it against nada's gameplans and pure mechanics. for those of you using this to claim casy is better, note that nada simply played to his strengths intelligently. he occasionally clearly outstripped casy in his own strengths, timing and micro.
i think casy's biggest fuck up is in game 2. showing the cc was completely sloppy and then the holding of the ramp was too. overall i'm extremely impressed with him and i'm sure he'll do fucking well with the two matchups he has. i'd like him to win another osl sometime.
but for now, i want to see nada easy savior nada doesn't choke in finals, and neither does savior at any rate the games will be amazing
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If (when) Savior beats Iris, it's gonna take me a week to figure out who to vote for in finals.
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Where are you yakii?. And where are your VODs yakii? T_T.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On February 14 2007 12:25 One Page Memory wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 12:19 Byyk wrote: To conclude if Savior beats all terrans on the such bad maps that is the prove that He is the best player of all time. GoGoGo Savior! All-time? You mean all-fucking-time? Maybe 2-3 years later, when Savior takes another 5-6 titles - yeah, but now - NO! And no misunderstandings - I am a Nada fan, but clearly Savior is better nowadays. he has shown teh most skill out of any player in history.
think of it this way, back when they were playing baseball with 160 lb guys, did the records mean as much?
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savior doesn't have yet the accomplishments nada boxer or oov have, when he will have 3 OSL titles like nada on his CJ uniform , then maybe we will be able to say he is the best player of all times
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If savior wins both OSL and MSL now he will have a total of 5 OSL/MSL wins. Nada is right now in the lead with 6 wins.. that would put him in 2nd place. Remember that NaDa got those wins over the last 5-6 years while all of saviors wins have been from little more than a year. Savior doesnt need to dominate much longer to be number one.
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Times have changed. OSL structure is different and much harder to win. Nada's last OSL was impressive, but his brackets still bother me.
I believe if Savior stomps Nada again, he can make a contention of best player ever, not based on tournament results but match results alone.
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although I am a savior fan, i have to say it is much more difficult to win in an OSL than in an MSL. You can feel the difference when you are watching the live game. A total count of OSL/MSL does not mean much 'cause an OSL title has more gold in it
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I think Nada should get a haircut for the finals...his hair is out of control.
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NaDa vs Casy. Game 3 @ Reverse Temple. Must See!!!. Go NaDa you can do this!!!. For The 4 Badges!!!.
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Anyone else notice when Nada dropped his Barracks a split second before Casy could drop his CC in the mineral field and Casy and to spend time on destroying it before landing his CC? I thought it was pretty cool
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thedeadhaji
39473 Posts
On February 14 2007 15:46 DrainX wrote: If savior wins both OSL and MSL now he will have a total of 5 OSL/MSL wins. Nada is right now in the lead with 6 wins.. that would put him in 2nd place. Remember that NaDa got those wins over the last 5-6 years while all of saviors wins have been from little more than a year. Savior doesnt need to dominate much longer to be number one.
the score is nada with 3 osl's to savior's 0, if you're going to compare victories. As cadical has mentioned many times, MSL is simply nowhere near Starleague in terms of prestige (which is MBC's fault apparently)
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On February 14 2007 17:07 thedeadhaji wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 15:46 DrainX wrote: If savior wins both OSL and MSL now he will have a total of 5 OSL/MSL wins. Nada is right now in the lead with 6 wins.. that would put him in 2nd place. Remember that NaDa got those wins over the last 5-6 years while all of saviors wins have been from little more than a year. Savior doesnt need to dominate much longer to be number one. the score is nada with 3 osl's to savior's 0, if you're going to compare victories. As cadical has mentioned many times, MSL is simply nowhere near Starleague in terms of prestige (which is MBC's fault apparently) I think one of the reasons could be this. iloveoov over BoxeR, Reach, YellOw (2004 Ever August - November 2004) July over GooDFriend, XellOs, GoRush (2005 Ever May 2005 - July 2005) AnyTime over BoxeR, iloveoov, PuSan (So1 August 2005 - November 2005) Historic Tournaments.
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Oh yay Nada won!
Had to sleep after game 4 -_-
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thedeadhaji
39473 Posts
On February 14 2007 17:26 [Carlodajin] wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 17:07 thedeadhaji wrote:On February 14 2007 15:46 DrainX wrote: If savior wins both OSL and MSL now he will have a total of 5 OSL/MSL wins. Nada is right now in the lead with 6 wins.. that would put him in 2nd place. Remember that NaDa got those wins over the last 5-6 years while all of saviors wins have been from little more than a year. Savior doesnt need to dominate much longer to be number one. the score is nada with 3 osl's to savior's 0, if you're going to compare victories. As cadical has mentioned many times, MSL is simply nowhere near Starleague in terms of prestige (which is MBC's fault apparently) I think one of the reasons could be this. iloveoov over BoxeR, Reach, YellOw (2004 Ever August - November 2004) July over GooDFriend, XellOs, GoRush (2005 Ever May 2005 - July 2005) AnyTime over BoxeR, iloveoov, PuSan (So1 August 2005 - November 2005) Historic Tournaments.
Not really. If you just look at field strength and participants etc, MSL is at least nearly on part with Starleague. Just look at the MSL's during 2006, or even the next one for 2007. They consistently have very strong players in their list. It most likely owes to the professionalism of the network, the presentation, the commentators, and everything else in between. Even though I don't understand korean at all, I can sense that the MBC commentators lack skill and maturity compared to their OGN counterparts from their voices
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OGN has heart, history, and hellish proportions.(Much harder.) MSL is a commercialized version of OGN, and sadly, most of their final games don't appear as epic as osl games. I dunno, I find MSL hollow, it has no soul. While OGN, you see the emotion, a fatigue, and a champion's bliss. When I see an MSL champion, I just see them in a form of self-satisfaction, nothing more. Also, MBC is way too forgiving to the losers, there is a whole survivor league/loser round setup, giving them a chance to bring themselves back from below. That's why you get to see shity 3rd rate players make it all the way to the semi-finals, hell, even the finals.
Also, I don't think there was a close series in MSL, i don't think there ever was a 3-2 series -..- MSL is like, a shadow to the current champion. An osl champion, can be anything.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
which are all as circumstantial as you can get for reasons to value msls lower than osl in terms of proving the strength of the player. as long as the tournament was played seriously with preparation i dont care if it was broadcasted by a monkey with a bad eye, or if it was played in some void space with no one around. These 'reasons' just explain biases in the population and incidentally reveals these biases to be nonsensical.
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There simply isn't room for two "major" leagues, one of them has to be less prestigious than the other. Compare SC to major league sports in North America; there's one big time league. There are things like the CFL and the WHL and shit like that, but they're small potatoes and casual fans don't give a shit about them. That's basically the position the MSL is in.
The MSL generally has better balanced maps, just as good players (if not better), and a better tournament format. They'll continue to get raped in the ratings by OGN because they've already been designated to being the "minor" league.
Did the OGN Starleagues start up before the MSL or something? I haven't been watching since the begining.
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Oh yeah. I didn't actually comment on the games at all.
NaDa's timing rushes in the first two games were near perfect and I though briefly that he was going to roll over Casy 3-0. Casy played brilliantly in game 3 and suprisingly, out-macro'd NaDa in game 4.
Casy played incredibly well, but in the final game NaDa played smarter. NaDa cut off Casy's attempts to get a fourth base twice and Casy put to much effort into dropping NaDa rather than securing another base and it cost him as NaDa was able to mine off 5 gas for a while. Casy basically starved himself.
Probably the most watchable TvT I've ever seen.
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I thought game 3 was really smart by Nada early game. He hid his superior marine count under the rax fucking over Casy hard and leading to 5+ scvs early game and even nullified wraith damage.
I honestly can't justify how Casy won except that was quite possibly the most perfect spot for a drop ever.
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United States10774 Posts
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Braavos36362 Posts
On February 14 2007 18:34 muramasa wrote: There simply isn't room for two "major" leagues, one of them has to be less prestigious than the other. Compare SC to major league sports in North America; there's one big time league. There are things like the CFL and the WHL and shit like that, but they're small potatoes and casual fans don't give a shit about them. That's basically the position the MSL is in.
The MSL generally has better balanced maps, just as good players (if not better), and a better tournament format. They'll continue to get raped in the ratings by OGN because they've already been designated to being the "minor" league.
Did the OGN Starleagues start up before the MSL or something? I haven't been watching since the begining. i wouldn't quite compare the OSL to the NFL and the MSL to the CFL, yes the OSL is more prestigious but not THAT much more, the CFL is basically not even worth mentioning
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United States10774 Posts
And yeah, OSL is a loooot more prestigious than MSL. MSL has recently caught up a lot, compared to the old times where nobody even really cared about it haha :O
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On February 14 2007 14:35 oneofthem wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 12:25 One Page Memory wrote:On February 14 2007 12:19 Byyk wrote: To conclude if Savior beats all terrans on the such bad maps that is the prove that He is the best player of all time. GoGoGo Savior! All-time? You mean all-fucking-time? Maybe 2-3 years later, when Savior takes another 5-6 titles - yeah, but now - NO! And no misunderstandings - I am a Nada fan, but clearly Savior is better nowadays. he has shown teh most skill out of any player in history. think of it this way, back when they were playing baseball with 160 lb guys, did the records mean as much?
ya they did because it was strictly skill back then( and really it is now, but a lot of people get passed up because of their size which is retarded to me, baseball is definately a "skill" sport, being athletic and big means nothing if you arent good.
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The final result of this semi must have been 3-0 for Nada. Just because the first two games ran too fast (few minutes each) which upset the fans, when Nada took a huge lead in the middle of game 3 he thought of doing smth miracle for the benefit of all of us, it's losing it :D . The genius went a bit too far when giving Casy game 4 also before took it seriously again and finished final game of a would-be totally boring bo5 haha Sorry Casy's fans, just joke : ) A die-hard fan of "Nothing"
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On February 14 2007 20:18 Sadist wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 14:35 oneofthem wrote:On February 14 2007 12:25 One Page Memory wrote:On February 14 2007 12:19 Byyk wrote: To conclude if Savior beats all terrans on the such bad maps that is the prove that He is the best player of all time. GoGoGo Savior! All-time? You mean all-fucking-time? Maybe 2-3 years later, when Savior takes another 5-6 titles - yeah, but now - NO! And no misunderstandings - I am a Nada fan, but clearly Savior is better nowadays. he has shown teh most skill out of any player in history. think of it this way, back when they were playing baseball with 160 lb guys, did the records mean as much? ya they did because it was strictly skill back then( and really it is now, but a lot of people get passed up because of their size which is retarded to me, baseball is definately a "skill" sport, being athletic and big means nothing if you arent good. well now a different example then, 100 meter sprint.
assuming tournament wins are skill based, all it means to win a tournament is that you were better than those who participated in teh tournament. given the amount of training and strategic evolution in progaming, i'd say that the current scene is much tougher than it was back then.
in any case, saying "who's the best" is pretty vague (to say the least) if one were to say "nada won teh most tourneys/dominated for the longest time/was elite for the longest time" then there would be no problem, and i dont think one would have a problem with something like "savior would win any/most player in history consistently"
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
On February 14 2007 20:06 Hot_Bid wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 18:34 muramasa wrote: There simply isn't room for two "major" leagues, one of them has to be less prestigious than the other. Compare SC to major league sports in North America; there's one big time league. There are things like the CFL and the WHL and shit like that, but they're small potatoes and casual fans don't give a shit about them. That's basically the position the MSL is in.
The MSL generally has better balanced maps, just as good players (if not better), and a better tournament format. They'll continue to get raped in the ratings by OGN because they've already been designated to being the "minor" league.
Did the OGN Starleagues start up before the MSL or something? I haven't been watching since the begining. i wouldn't quite compare the OSL to the NFL and the MSL to the CFL, yes the OSL is more prestigious but not THAT much more, the CFL is basically not even worth mentioning
It's not really a league though; it's tournaments with qualification stages. So the analogy doesn't hold water.
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I don't think it's a great analogy either. But the fact is they're both televised sports (I think we all agree on this) on several times a week. A casual fan isn't going to tune in to watch 20 hours of SC a week, so for them there's only room to follow one league. And from what Korean posters here say, the people choose to watch the OSL over the MSL for whatever reasons.
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thedeadhaji
39473 Posts
On February 14 2007 21:50 oneofthem wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 20:18 Sadist wrote:On February 14 2007 14:35 oneofthem wrote:On February 14 2007 12:25 One Page Memory wrote:On February 14 2007 12:19 Byyk wrote: To conclude if Savior beats all terrans on the such bad maps that is the prove that He is the best player of all time. GoGoGo Savior! All-time? You mean all-fucking-time? Maybe 2-3 years later, when Savior takes another 5-6 titles - yeah, but now - NO! And no misunderstandings - I am a Nada fan, but clearly Savior is better nowadays. he has shown teh most skill out of any player in history. think of it this way, back when they were playing baseball with 160 lb guys, did the records mean as much? ya they did because it was strictly skill back then( and really it is now, but a lot of people get passed up because of their size which is retarded to me, baseball is definately a "skill" sport, being athletic and big means nothing if you arent good. well now a different example then, 100 meter sprint. assuming tournament wins are skill based, all it means to win a tournament is that you were better than those who participated in teh tournament. given the amount of training and strategic evolution in progaming, i'd say that the current scene is much tougher than it was back then. in any case, saying "who's the best" is pretty vague (to say the least) if one were to say "nada won teh most tourneys/dominated for the longest time/was elite for the longest time" then there would be no problem, and i dont think one would have a problem with something like "savior would win any/most player in history consistently"
your statements are virtually identical to the arguments that I have seen when comparing differnt eras of baseball (steriods era, the "lowered" mound era, the negro league era) or golf (tiger woods-2000, jack nicklaus-1970, ben hogan-1950, bobby jones-1920).
This kind of argument never works
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On February 14 2007 05:05 SuperJongMan wrote: Day~~ Thank you for coming to my defence. Now we can cry together.
Tissue? Add me too
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On February 14 2007 22:23 thedeadhaji wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2007 21:50 oneofthem wrote:On February 14 2007 20:18 Sadist wrote:On February 14 2007 14:35 oneofthem wrote:On February 14 2007 12:25 One Page Memory wrote:On February 14 2007 12:19 Byyk wrote: To conclude if Savior beats all terrans on the such bad maps that is the prove that He is the best player of all time. GoGoGo Savior! All-time? You mean all-fucking-time? Maybe 2-3 years later, when Savior takes another 5-6 titles - yeah, but now - NO! And no misunderstandings - I am a Nada fan, but clearly Savior is better nowadays. he has shown teh most skill out of any player in history. think of it this way, back when they were playing baseball with 160 lb guys, did the records mean as much? ya they did because it was strictly skill back then( and really it is now, but a lot of people get passed up because of their size which is retarded to me, baseball is definately a "skill" sport, being athletic and big means nothing if you arent good. well now a different example then, 100 meter sprint. assuming tournament wins are skill based, all it means to win a tournament is that you were better than those who participated in teh tournament. given the amount of training and strategic evolution in progaming, i'd say that the current scene is much tougher than it was back then. in any case, saying "who's the best" is pretty vague (to say the least) if one were to say "nada won teh most tourneys/dominated for the longest time/was elite for the longest time" then there would be no problem, and i dont think one would have a problem with something like "savior would win any/most player in history consistently" your statements are virtually identical to the arguments that I have seen when comparing differnt eras of baseball (steriods era, the "lowered" mound era, the negro league era) or golf (tiger woods-2000, jack nicklaus-1970, ben hogan-1950, bobby jones-1920). This kind of argument never works it works for the people who argue them and buy them, wonder why.
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Braavos36362 Posts
"it works for the people who argue them and buy them"
with that logic you can justify just about anything
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On February 14 2007 23:02 Hot_Bid wrote: "it works for the people who argue them and buy them"
with that logic you can justify just about anything it obviously is not a justification, just an opportunity to ask why.
I would think it has more content than "This kind of argument never works"
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thedeadhaji
39473 Posts
I dont really want to write a 10 page paper on why comparing different eras in sports is unjustified. Sportswriters across the country have already done this many times, and if you were so inclined, you could easily find sources for yourself ascelon
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On February 14 2007 23:16 thedeadhaji wrote: I dont really want to write a 10 page paper on why comparing different eras in sports is unjustified. Sportswriters across the country have already done this many times, and if you were so inclined, you could easily find sources for yourself ascelon well yes i already outlined that comparisons are limited. so i am only disagreeing with the meaningfulness of certain comparisons between different eras, and not others. i think thought experiments that take a contemporary player and puts him in a historical situation are meaningful because they capture the irreducible mechanics of the game in ways that a simple tournament result does not.
i think baseball research is the most mature sports research and there are serious works done on what sort of meaningful comparisons can be made between players or teams of different eras, and there are quite a few good arguments for quite a few comparisons.
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5377 Posts
Regardless of baseball, eras, 10 page papers, arguing, analogies, buying, and getting opportunities to say why... Savior has to consistently dominate more than just this OSL to be considered the best of all time.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
well i would agree, and i think the question of "best of all time" is meaningless to a large degree.
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You cant get the best of all time by dominating a ''sport''/''bw'' for a short time. You have to get the most titles and play at the very top for the longest time possible and that is exactly what NaDa did and still does and what savior does and is probably still going to do for a while. If savior plays like this 2 or even more years and gets like 2 or even 3 more osl titels and some other titles he can be called best gamer of all time.
For me the phrase 'best gamer of all time' has to be very objective. So i basicaly would call it ''the player who won the most tournaments and stayed near or at the very top of his sports for the longest time''. The first part is pretty easily to determine.. the 2nd is a bit vague.. and not so objective..
but savior has A LOT of still to do in order to get the best bw player of all time. EVen NaDa who is the MOST SUCCESSFULL of all time isnt clearly the best of all time, because Boxers still too much hof a legend..
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I think the final is gonna be decided by destiny. Things like maps and skill will take no part in it.
After reading the thread about Savior going for the MSL/OSL slam, it seems as though Savior was destined to win it all, fighting against all odds and fighting against the maps.
In the other corner, you have Nada, who shattered the hearts of Protoss fans everywhere by breaking the legend of the fall, then coming back next season and spitting at the OSL curse right in the face.
No matter how much analysis we do, we cannot predict what fate has in store for these two gamers.
PS: Iris better not win
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Excellent post, Purind. Best post in this thread, and it reflects the same feelings I have about this OSL.
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That picture of Casy is just TOO funny hahahahahaha Lim Yo Han spirit hahaha Whoever drew that is my new idol :D
I will be cheering for NaDa though, as he is my favorite player ^^ Gogogooggo Lee Y Y!!!!!!!!
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On February 15 2007 12:21 Sacajawea wrote: Excellent post, Purind. Best post in this thread, and it reflects the same feelings I have about this OSL.
No, *insert random flame* best post in the thread was definitely the first one.
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