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Sweden33719 Posts
http://sc.gosugamers.net/thread.php?id=22272 Dr_Deadmeat made a post on gosugamers about making a starcraft instructional video (he wanted replays that showed specific things etc). Thought of something like this before but eh, unlike him, I was too lazy to ever do anything about it but now that he is..
Posted this over on gg.net; Hehe, I've had this idea before as well, but I was thinking more of an instructional movie, ie someone talking and showing what to do on a first person screen.
Like make one about the early game, one about those 'little things' and common beginners mistakes, then strat specific ones and so on.
Good luck with it, I suggest you post on teamliquid.net as well for some more input
Or, if you don't mind, I could make a thread about it and link this one? Eitherway, it's a great initiative, nice to see you are not as lazy as I am :D
So, does anyone think it could be done? Could be like a great encyclopedia of BW knowledge for beginners I don't think it's a 1 man project tho, would need at least a player per race (preferably more, and preferably with good spoken english), video editors etc..
I find this idea really good to be honest, if you've ever seen a martial arts instructional video you'll know what I'm envisioning - showing techniques/tips individually then showing this technique when applied in a real game..
Post away =]
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Belgium6733 Posts
Like the progamer 'How To' vods by nada,themarine and yellow?
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i would much prefer good players take a rep or a vod and analysis the late and mid game situations and speak their thoughts + mindset like if they were playing it. The early game stuff is known by nearly all bw players and it isn't that hard to pick up and there are already many website + guides dedicated to it.
what i'm talking about is exactly what they do with chess and go games in China.
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Sweden33719 Posts
On May 29 2006 08:52 Xeofreestyler wrote: Like the progamer 'How To' vods by nada,themarine and yellow? No, not exactly, they play mock games kind of and only cover a single build order.
I'd want to do like one video on basics (ie splitting/cloning, basic micro rules, building placement, using buildings to improve mining, things like keeping up worker production and so on).
Then one that focuses on a specific matchup or race (ie a PvZ one would have some more PvZ specific tips like help on interpreting what you scout and show some build orders, discuss them, show the variations, show them in game with the player commentating like haduken said).
Maybe one that focuses on all those cute little tricks (killing invisible things with splash, jumping walls, manner pylon/gas rushing and when not to do it, dropship micro, marine micro, although I suppose some of these would be in the race specific videos).
It's a pretty ambitious project but would be really cool.
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Belgium6733 Posts
Oh I see That would be cool yeah =)
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He wants to do like a feature video, I think the idea it's amazing, but it will take a while to develop it.
Gogo for it!.
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is awesome32247 Posts
I had this idea as well. Like showing a lurk ling force engagins a m&m group an letting them attack ground, and then showing they results with micro.
How do drone defence with sunks against a rush, muta micro, cloning.
the hardest part i found when i tried to play a little with this is making the specific maps for shwing this because i suck at making maps (like a map with a group of m&m vs some zerg force)
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I qoute myself from gosugamers.net and I say that I am in the middle of a exam round and if I am luky I can start on tuesday next week (6. july 2006) If I am lucky, and then I will start with downloading some vods, and making FPreps =)... Anyway, if you have any suggestions I have bookmarked both this site and the one at gosugamers so I will check it regulary =)
Thanks for all positive and helpfully response for now =)
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I love the idea and would love to help in this, but I don't see any way, because I suck at playing If you have anything I could help you with, ask (and no, i don't have any video editing skills...).
Edit: I've watched thousands of reps, I'm not completely clueless
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Cool, i can help with zerg ;D
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I can help with terran, I am gosu at all 3 but terran > all
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What format are you planning on?
If you're planning on doing a different video for each race, you might have to start at a higher level than "new player" since there is a lot of good advice that will not find it's place because it is not race-specific. (this is not limited to early game)
I like the idea of a single video, even if it's long (large to dl) so maybe you could find a way to connect all the individual videos in a comprehensive one instead? Also the "gimmicks and tricks" part is something I'm sure will attract more audience than matchup-specific tips, even though they aren't as difficult to find out or learn.. so please be sure to include that
I really think that, aside from the quality of the advice, what this video needs is an easy to follow, logical and natural-flowing story-telling feel to it, with a balance between increasing the difficulty of the advice given and keeping it arranged by race, matchup or concept (macro, micro, game mechanics, basic unit counters, build orders, about terrain, scouting, about maps, map-specific, strategy and ..gimmicks?).
For example, you wouldn't want to include fragments from korean pros' first person vods until later in the video, when the viewer has supposedly assimilated the information provided and can make sense of what he sees. Analysis of specific pro games should also be reserved for the end of the video (although this part can be as long as all of the others combined), as they would require an undestanding of all the concepts individually and a new sense of combining them to reach an end result.
An alternative is an inbetween solution, that is, after the basics have been covered, have each matchup (or race) section start at low level and gradually increase in difficulty.
Another point I want to make, which is more of a request really is to always have in mind the importance of explaining why. Why does zeal/temp work vs pure hydra, why are chokes important, why proxy in middle of map etc. This will give more depth and is sure to immerse the viewer deeper than just a list of counters, build orders or things that simply "work".
In view of this, perhaps including a concise history of each matchup at some point in their individual videos will give a sense of how the game evolved (this will help to better understand for ex, why fast expanding is more popular than 2 years ago or why unit combinations have changed).. Nothing too fancy, but don't overlook how maps, overall technique and most of all strategy have evolved.
Maybe sprinkled and scattered in the video you could include the psychological aspect of the game. Not letting yourself be intimidated by your opponent, knowing to fake weaknesses, keeping cool after gaining an advantage (being aware that the player at a disadvantage plays more fiercely than before), not underestimating those rated lower than you, how making a bad decision and carrying it out is better than not making a decision at all, learning from mistakes. How it has become a "mind game" at the highest levels... Things that connect it to all other competitions.
Also please read the recommended threads , it's probably the most valuable collection of information you can find on this forum.
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Same here, I've been mussing about this idea too. But I know I don't have the skills to make a good video.
If anyone is interested I'll gladly make a "magazine" style guide as a backup to the videos. And I only have my humble writing skills, and newbish photoshoping skills to contribue. But I would gladly try to learn photoshop just for this project, cause hell I plan on learning it anyways.
And I if anyone else, who is more qualified, wants to take hold of this project, feel free to do so. I only ask that you let me help so I can learn from you
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I'm really excited about this idea, this is what I'm envisioning (is that a word? oO):
It would be two movies, which you could give out to interested friends, which, after watching them, would give them a good idea of what StarCraft is about. My goal wouldn't be to help advanced players, but to help the clueless.
I think I'd want to make (if I can help with anything -_-) the following movies:
A movie that generally answers the question what StarCraft really is. I keep having friends asking me, what the fuck it is that I always do on the computer and I can try to explain about StarCraft and the Korean scene, but they never really understand, because they can't even picture people going to a stadium to watch two people playing a video game. The video should contain imo:
- a very general explanation of what StarCraft is (a Strategy game with three battling races, where you have to build up an economy and train fighters to help you win the game over the opponent)
- what sets StarCraft apart from other strategy games (speed, strategical depth, etc., maybe show a few cool battle scenes)
- the Korean scene, how people there are professional StarCraft gamers, and show some games with a lot of people watching :p
- The point of this whole movie would be to make people want to play StarCraft, or make parents understand, what it is they’re kids are doing, so it would have to be very interesting and cool :p
The second movie would really go into the matchups and give advice, the thing Doctorasul was talking about in his post. It should definitely have a story feeling to it and become more and more detailed until the end. The general aim of the movie, would be that if some newbie watched (and a total game newbie as well) would have a good idea of what matters in StarCraft and what the 6 matchups are about and how they typically progress.
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Sweden33719 Posts
Not that I know if dr_deadmeat would be interested in this, but I think this could be a good community project, ie everyone pitching in :O
But maybe he just wanted to do this himself (just kinda realized that I might have stepped on his toes somewhat, in case this was something he wanted to do alone :>).
Although that doesn't really make it impossible for anyone else to copy him :D
It would be cool if it could be organized like you said, Orome, ie:
Introduction (what you wrote)
General BW concepts (ie a quick rundown of worker production, expanding, rushing, teching, maybe an introduction to some common BW terms, basic micro, ramps/high ground, trees..)
Race (and perhaps matchup) specific videos, going into more detail on how what was laid out in the first video changes depending on matchup and so on. Introducing build orders, matchup or race specific tricks etc.
Other (where you'd throw in the gimmicky stuff ).
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Even if everyone's pitching in, you definitely have to have people in charge, so he could still run the whole project
Edit: You posted again, while I was writing
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Sweden33719 Posts
On May 29 2006 17:56 Orome wrote:Even if everyone's pitching in, you definitely have to have people in charge, so he could still run the whole project Edit: You posted again, while I was writing And a 3rd time :D!
Yeah, true =]
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The highest principle should be that it has to be watchable for non-nerds That's why I think you should put the whole gameplay into one movie, because I think there's a higher chance that people that are semi-interested are going to watch one movie covering everything, than six movies covering each matchup seperately. I also think the TvZ, TvP and PvZ should be explained in one, ie not showing the Terran's perspective first and then the Zerg's, but showing both together and how they react to each other. Even for people that aren't necessarily interested in becoming a progamer (my parents for instance :p), it could be interesting to watch, how the different strategies correspond to each other and what a player's goal is depending on what strategy he and his opponent used and so on.
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Sweden33719 Posts
Well, it seems like a very massive project to get it all into one video - would be easier to do it in steps at least (to maintain interest and motivation too).
But I guess the first video could include a basic rundown of strategies too or that it all could be made into one big video eventually.
Or one video like what you described and the rest later=]
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We'll see.^^ I'd love to have a movie that you could just show to people, who ask, what StarCraft is. Would stop a lot of wtf reactions from my friends/family :p I really need to go to bed now.^^
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Sounds great. I liked the idea of creating a video for each race.
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On May 29 2006 17:56 Orome wrote:Even if everyone's pitching in, you definitely have to have people in charge, so he could still run the whole project Edit: You posted again, while I was writing Yes, we really need a person in charge for this ambitious idea to even work. A person whose vision everyone can agree with.
And man, all of us should really get together somtimes, on aim or msn. It'll be alot easier to discuss the project.
-t1.gokai
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The video should also imform players, about the most important aspects of the game also... Reading the opponent, Determining his flaws, and punishing him/her for their mistakes..
Overall: Great idea
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would be better to do it in small videos i think, though it would be pretty cool to be able to combine it into a single DVD and sell it or whatever
nice idea i think
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Just realised how long this would have to be to include everything And the amount of work put into those small by comparison 10-min highlight movies is discouraging, not to mention this is not just longer, but harder as it needs a script and coherent explanations.
So... everybody contribute! This needs your help That is unless the man with the plan decides to do it by himself
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I sure need help, because I have none skills in BW/SC, and my only skills are in video editing, and at last I am a supporter of the GPL license. If you dont know what that means, it means for example: I make a program/movie/music you get it for free... But you would preffer it to be more like another thing, and you edit it and give it away for free and everyone is happy =)
I would love to get some help =) Add my MSN: anhjort@gmail.com if you are interested (and I am no good leader for a big project, so if anyone would like step in and become a leader who can organise I would be happy, if not I have to be the leader...) Just keep coming with suggestions =) I have to reformat my cpu to get windows on it again (don't really like that idea) so I can use a video editing program I like (besides camtasia)
I had a plan about realesing it as a "extra material dvd" like those you get with most movies you buy were you can get a bit background information about the game, some easy strats, and later on you can choose ether to learn about protoss, terran or zerg... It will be a big project I think, but I got a lot of spare time after tuesday next week (unless I am very unlucky) and I can work on it a while (but I am going to a vacation in the summer holiday... Sorry) You showed more interest than I thought, and I thought this would be a stand alone project, but I am glad for all help I can get as earlier mentioned =)
Thanks for all the interest that is for this project =)
PS: This post might be a bit dissordered, and I am sorry for that =P
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Oh and 1 thing- You should decide on how early of a gamer you want this to reach- if you also want to get more people into SC- then a little more care should cover what the game is about- not more time necessarily-
SOmething that briefly describes how it is a game that rivals chess in strategy. How most game are time consumers- And this one will keep you at your max potential every game- just like chess. But the begenning has to look good and sound impressive- SO that the people can start watching thinking- oh cool- prettyyyy- (Or something like that)
then it should be followed with a small story fo each race and briefly how the units work- and an adress where they can study the basics- then a disclaimer that if they do not understand each unit that well- they will be able to understand the following strategies better if they look them up at a website.
Then the replays should be in gradient order- starting with terran, zerg, toss the main strategies should be listed in importance and a quick rep that follows each one- like "The very begening- Sending your workers to mine- You can just select them all then right click the minerals - but you can get mierals faster if you... like in this replay here...
So this movie could actually be really short as the rep would only have to be as long is neded to explain the theory.
In the very begening, the instructional videos- DO not necessarily need to be done by expert players- a begging player will do better for 2 reasons- 1 you can also capture the non gosu mouse movement and the beginers wont be as mad when they "see how bad they are compared to the gosu's even at these basic levels"
then, after the intro, and basics have been dealt with- YOu can get into pure strategy- and show gosu reps containing those ideas- And now you dont want to see the actual gamers gosu mouse movement- or the player might feel so insubordinate in comparison- but there should eb a small note- that these are replays of starcrafts best players- and although these reps really aid us in studying these strategies, know that they are clicking thier mouse at amazing speeds.
hope this helps- You ca do it! good luck >_< O_O @_o
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Gret idea! are the "How to" vods actually like staged games? Just curious...
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On May 29 2006 10:19 indecision wrote: love it
Need it
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I would very much like to be a part of this in one way or another.
Of course it will have to be done in steps. This can't be done in one big video, nor would it be any easier at all.
We'll make you a big rar, Mr too lazy to download flashget.
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Doing it in only in one or two (as I suggested yesterday) movies would be impossible, now I'm not dead tired anymore and think about it. While the movies would be basic, covering all 6 matchups in one movie would be way too long. I think we should keep the idea of my first movie (the one that answers, what StarCraft is), but split the second one about the different matchups up like this:
One movie about the general mindset in StarCraft. What is expanding, what is macro, what is micro, what is teching, what is massing? What goals are you trying to achieve through expanding, how should you react to your opponent teching/massing/expanding and why? The point of this movie would be to get people interested and to make them realize just how fascinating this whole world of strategy games and bw in particular is.
One movie about each of the matchups, ie TvT TvP TvZ PvP PvZ ZvZ.
One movie about miscellaneous things for interested people, like worker cloning, dropping with the dropships still moving, spreading storms out automatically, laying mines, dropship micro and just little useless stuff that some people might be interested in.
A few more things about how I think the non-mirror matchup movies should be done:
First, I think we should establish, what the main problem is for each race, when they fight against the other one. From this, we should make people realize, why for example people mainly use metal against P and bio and metal against Z (ie M&M die horribly to Storm/Reaver/DT, so they're not viable most of the time against Protoss, while, when microed correctly against Z, they can kill incredibly much with minimal losses). Then, we should demonstrate, how a normal game of the matchup goes (without sounding too theoretic and always pronouncing that there's room for innovation ). To do this I think we should take about 3 different games with different openings (for example 2 fac, 1 fac expo and 1 fac port or fd or w/e) and show, how the game progresses differently and how the goal of the players are different, according to the strat they used. We could keep switching between the replays to show, how differently the games evolve. I thought of more stuff, but can't remember it right now :/ Anyone interested in participating in this, feel free to add lorenz_jaeger at hotmail dot com to your msn.
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I understand the problem Orome with making it to one movie, but I have faith in your new model were we cover some aspects of the game in many movies =) I want to go for that, but since this is a project many wants to participate in I think we will make that descission democratic =)
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there was something like that five years ago in german. it was only for zvp on lost temple. i don't think it showed ppl much how to play. but if you do it right and you explain a lot of things (not just play one game and comment) this could work. to be really helpfull you'd have to depict everything very clearly, because following your explanations will not be easy for a newbie.
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Sweden33719 Posts
On May 30 2006 13:54 Orome wrote:Doing it in only in one or two (as I suggested yesterday) movies would be impossible, now I'm not dead tired anymore and think about it. While the movies would be basic, covering all 6 matchups in one movie would be way too long. I think we should keep the idea of my first movie (the one that answers, what StarCraft is), but split the second one about the different matchups up like this: One movie about the general mindset in StarCraft. What is expanding, what is macro, what is micro, what is teching, what is massing? What goals are you trying to achieve through expanding, how should you react to your opponent teching/massing/expanding and why? The point of this movie would be to get people interested and to make them realize just how fascinating this whole world of strategy games and bw in particular is. One movie about each of the matchups, ie TvT TvP TvZ PvP PvZ ZvZ. One movie about miscellaneous things for interested people, like worker cloning, dropping with the dropships still moving, spreading storms out automatically, laying mines, dropship micro and just little useless stuff that some people might be interested in. A few more things about how I think the non-mirror matchup movies should be done: First, I think we should establish, what the main problem is for each race, when they fight against the other one. From this, we should make people realize, why for example people mainly use metal against P and bio and metal against Z (ie M&M die horribly to Storm/Reaver/DT, so they're not viable most of the time against Protoss, while, when microed correctly against Z, they can kill incredibly much with minimal losses). Then, we should demonstrate, how a normal game of the matchup goes (without sounding too theoretic and always pronouncing that there's room for innovation ). To do this I think we should take about 3 different games with different openings (for example 2 fac, 1 fac expo and 1 fac port or fd or w/e) and show, how the game progresses differently and how the goal of the players are different, according to the strat they used. We could keep switching between the replays to show, how differently the games evolve. I thought of more stuff, but can't remember it right now :/ Anyone interested in participating in this, feel free to add lorenz_jaeger at hotmail dot com to your msn. 100% agreed =]
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Considering the depth of starcraft, I think it would be wise to start small. In fact, perhaps a 2 hour movie about a single matchup would be insatisfactory in the long run.
We could focus our efforts on the "Introduction to starcraft" first, but it would be nice if we could make some references to the strategical elements of starcraft, since we should be boasting about the strategical value of the game, better prove it while we're at it.
So I think we should outline what starcraft is about, this is a good framework regardless what move we are working on. I think if you include Macro/ Micro/ Strategy (timing)/ Strategy (unit/tech choice)/ Recon&Deception/Multitasking you've pretty much summed up all there is to starcraft.
So if you're doing the introductory movie you could talk about these things and why they are important, examples, blabla, I think you could easily fill 20~30 minutes with that, which is about the average attention span of most people, maybe even lower for people that are new to the game and are just checking it out. You better make it interesting with some gosu video editing skills and keep your talking smooth.
Then you can do race specific movies, discussing units, unit counters, general 'personality' of a race some example builds etc. This will draw new people even more into the game, even help them with a race choice.
Then you can get really technical in matchup-specific movies, you could put each of the things I mentioned above Macro/ Micro/ Strategy (timing)/ Strategy (unit/tech choice)/ Recon&Deception/ Multitasking in their own section and just talk specifically about that for some time. Maybe you don't get to cross-reference things that way but at least it helps people learn and remember, and it also helps keeping people concentrated, if they at least vaguely know what you are talking about.
For Macro, you could mention worker count, expansion count, how many unit producing buildings you need to have in proportion to this. For micro you could show common battles and show a few microing techniques and the specific things you need to look for. Maybe slow-motion? Timing would be really difficult, maybe we could get an interview with some gosu player to talk about timing for a bit, maybe all of us could contribute some to this section and figure out some brilliant way to present it. For unit choice you could list basic counters and build order countering, play out example games to show what the game looks like 5-10 minutes later after different opening choices of players. Recon and deception would naturally follow from this. You could show how each opening choice works best in what particular situation and how to trick or manouvre your opponent into that sitation. Multitasking doesn't really belong in here, but you could list good hotkey choices being close to certain letters for efficient hotkeying, you could explain what units need their own hotkeys because you need access to them fast. Blablabla I guess I need to stop my monologue here.
All of this is random brainstorming. Don't look at it too harshly, 99% of this needs to and will be modified.
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I have got many great ideas here, but I lost my internet connection yesterday and I haven't got to do anything about it... But now I got internet back and I will download reps and vods that I can work with... Thanks for all the help, but more suggestions is still welcomed =)
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Just a question...
Does anyone knows were I can find vods, reps and stuff that I can use in the movie? I could always use the TL tracker, but I don't know what games I can use and stuff.
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Sweden33719 Posts
Hm well, if you mean reps/vds that show of how interesting BW can be.. Kingdom vs Reach, boxer vs shinhwa (as much as I hate it that boxer lost, game 1 and 3 were interesting), nal_ra vs goodfriend. (Both should be on tracker)
Reach vs Boxer from SKY 2002, 4th game, but the quality on that vod isn't as high as todays vods.. (http://www.war3.spb.ru) Stork vs Themarine[name] (or casy[name]), http://www.yaoyuan.com/show.php?SID=44517
Nada vs Ameba Link Also highly suggest ameba vs lomo[fou], which is uploaded here on TL.
Almost every single replay in the TL.net replays section is interesting (ie they look good).
Oh, Gorush vs Nal_rA on forte - http://www.yaoyuan.com/show.php?SID=37051 AWESOME game.
I'll probably think of another million sooner or later Boxer vs Oov EVER 2004 final game 4 is very nice, reach vs yellow game 5 ever 2004 3rd place match is really good too (both should be available at yaoyuan.com).
I think for the instructional bit, we should make our own reps/vods of whatever it is we are focusing on, then find it applied in a real game (preferably one of said player, I wonder if we could get midian/day/testie to help And some terran, hm.
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quoting what i said in the gg.net thread:
"producing this well is hell a lot of work, as you would have to do most of the playing yourself to capture the mouse live with camtasia or smthing.
i thought this project through about a year ago and came to the conclusion that its just too much work for a single person, yet its too difficult to split over the internet."
working with replays just isn't going to work as new players will be confused big-time. also you really need to see when and how someone moves his mouse around, clicks or uses hotkeys to really explain what is happening during a broowar game on a basic level.
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It can be split over the internet if you have a dedicated community and someone that gives such narrow instructions that there is hardly room for error.
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well, it would be enough if more RWA were made with comments, like one Twisted made of Mondragon:
"He is doing this because of that, and now he will do this to prevent that, but now he is suffering of this because he didn't do X."
that's the best way to learn in my opinion. To play at his full potential a guy has to be concentrated.
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Sweden33719 Posts
On June 01 2006 07:18 jacen wrote: quoting what i said in the gg.net thread:
"producing this well is hell a lot of work, as you would have to do most of the playing yourself to capture the mouse live with camtasia or smthing.
i thought this project through about a year ago and came to the conclusion that its just too much work for a single person, yet its too difficult to split over the internet."
working with replays just isn't going to work as new players will be confused big-time. also you really need to see when and how someone moves his mouse around, clicks or uses hotkeys to really explain what is happening during a broowar game on a basic level. He can get a couple of good players to show different things (I'm almost certain nony would be game for this, I would, maybe midian? maybe day? maybe testie?) and record it, then he/others would do the editing :>
But for the first video we'd need some replays/vods just to show off the game you know? What it looks like and so on, as well as the bare basics of an instructional ;p
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this project could take months for it to be somewhat decent. there is so much to consider that you may detour from it. but having your enthusiasm will surely motivate others to do well and hold their spirits up. My thought about the project: when introducing Build Orders (BOs) you should give credit to those who created them, like the Gundam Rush. Followed by the Pros and Cons and demonstrating them personally. after demonstrating it personally with audio, show a replay of the orignal creator executing it.
As for mirco, macro, expoing, etc demonstrate these into individual videos as well because they don't belong to one race so making 3 videos isn't well suited. if you try to bunch them up, it'll be unorganized and alittle bit confusing for the new player.
-and also present everything concisely. if you do a well job in explaining details the more deserving in why it should be an official guide.
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There is sooooo much to cover though... i'm sure you could easily make enough videos for a DVD O_O it sounds like a project that would take up most of your time, and when you finish it'll probably be under close scrutiny. but on the other hand, i'm sure a lot of people would appreciate your effort no matter how it turned out.
so if you do decide to go for it, good luck!
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Sweden33719 Posts
On June 01 2006 10:37 hsidori wrote: There is sooooo much to cover though... i'm sure you could easily make enough videos for a DVD O_O it sounds like a project that would take up most of your time, and when you finish it'll probably be under close scrutiny. but on the other hand, i'm sure a lot of people would appreciate your effort no matter how it turned out.
so if you do decide to go for it, good luck! Yeah, making it into a dvd would be ideal
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i'd really love to help, but wont be able to
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I think we should all get together on msn or irc and discuss this through, about who wants to do what and how we're going to do it. I'm sure that a huge project like this will fail horribly, if it isn't planned well. As I said before, anyone interested in helping, add lorenz_jaeger at hotmail dot com to your list and we should fix a time, where we can really talk this over.
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I will make it into a DVD, but first I will produce them as many short movies were I cover a bit for bit, and when I have enough to make a DVD iso I will just make everything to a DVD iso that you can use everywere... I still cant begin to start on tuesday when I have my last homework for this school year, but I would still want many suggestions and tips... I check this site on a regular basis and I have decided that I are to make at least 1 hour of educational movie =P
Anyway... Thanks for all the help I have gotten so far I will thank FrozenArbiter to come up with some links to games, but I still need more, and I still want suggestions, so keep them coming =)
(If you want to join the project ether with suplying with vods when you plays, or reps or video editing etc. add me to my MSN: anhjort at gmail.com)
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If anyone knows how, we could make a IRC channel about this too =)
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How about the teamliquid IRC channel? It's quiet enough.
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On June 01 2006 08:26 FrozenArbiter wrote: He can get a couple of good players to show different things (I'm almost certain nony would be game for this, I would, maybe midian? maybe day? maybe testie?) and record it, then he/others would do the editing :> have fun sending 400mb clips over the internet. and that is only if you can get the players to compress their videos with huffman.
as i said ... it will take ages and consume enormous ammounts of bandwith to get all the video material to the ppl that are editing/cutting it.
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Sweden33719 Posts
Bittorrent isn't that hard to use honestly.. And you can make stuff a hell of a lot smaller than 400 mb - hell, if movies you download can be compressed to take up just 600~ mb, I'm sure this could be done here too =.= (although I realize that compressing videos of BW makes it kinda ugly).
Anyway, I don't think it's as hard as you make it out to be as long as people have good connections and patience. DC++ or bittorrent would be fine.. Speaking of Dc++, maybe setting up a hub just for this could work (sharing files + chat).
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There's already been 21 episodes on GameTV.co.kr:
http://gametv.co.kr/index.php?module=tv&submodule=program&pgm_code=15
The guy actually begins to teach you Starcraft on a chalkboard, with the basic layout of buildings, but surprisingly covers the basics quickly and thoroughly. He knows the viewer knows something about Starcraft, so he gets into the theories quickly. I particularly liked his theory using the graph that looked like f(x) = sin x.
They prepare the program well, with UseMapSettings that they've made to simulate certain situations (like attacking from both sides versus attacking from one side). He also shows you replays and VODs of progamers that support the topics he's teaching.
A lot of what you guys said, such as introducing Starcraft, what it is, and what is so appealing about it, to topics such as differentiating the tech-trees for Protoss (how Cybernetics Core is the main root, which branches into either Robotics tech, Templar tech, or Stargate Tech in a given game) are all covered in the VODs.
These are the episodes he's covered (each is around 45~60 minutes long):
1. Introduction - Moving on from a Chobo 2. Differences of the three races, relationships in tech tree 3. Units and Control 4. Organization of Control & Classification of Units 5. Understanding Units 6. Classification of Attack-Types, Unit Sizes & Group Control 7. Real Tactics Lecture (1) - Worker Tactics 8. Real Tactics Lecture (2) - Basic Units' Battle 9. Real Tactics Lecture (3) - Defensive Tactics and Expansion 10. Real Tactics Lecture (4) - Group Movements & Employing Tactics 11. Real Tactics Lecture (5) - Splash 12. Real Tactics Lecture (6) - Magic 13. Way To Conquer Each Race (1) - Terran vs Zerg 14. Way To Conquer Each Race (2) - Zerg vs Terran 15. Way To Conquer Each Race (1) - Terran vs Protoss 16. Way To Conquer Each Race (2) - Protoss vs Terran 17. Way To Conquer Each Race (1) - Protoss vs Zerg 18. Way To Conquer Each Race (2) - Zerg vs Protoss 19. Way To Fight the Same Race (1) - Zerg vs Zerg Part One 20. Way To Fight the Same Race (2) - Zerg vs Zerg Part Two 21. Way To Fight the Same Race (1) - Protoss vs Protoss Part One ============================
Apparently the program was cancelled. Gametv hasn't really been active for the past year or so. But this was the most thorough VODs I've seen so far in terms of teaching Starcraft. I think some korean people on the forums on the website were talking about translating them into Chinese. I would translate them to English, but I don't know how to save the video files + put subtitles.
MBCGame also has this "Starcraft Class" with IntoTheRain, where he teaches you certain builds and strategies, first showing you the replay and then showing an actual VOD of the thing.
The only thing close to teaching Starcraft from Ongamenet that I've seen was the few minutes where a progamer comes out and teaches you little tips, which you've probably seen, such as Pusan[S.G] teaching you how to get rid of spider mines without observers.
If anyone could teach me how to capture the VODs and add subtitles, I could work on them.
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Sweden33719 Posts
:o Wow.
Well, I don't know how to subtitle but googling brought up http://armitage.crinkle.net/karinkuru/howtosub/ which seems well-done at a glance :o
That would be really cool to have translated, but even so, it would be fun to make one. + I'm sure there are things we'd want to cover which isn't in this ;O
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is awesome32247 Posts
Nice info instantbuzz
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Are msn, aim and yahoo messenger compatible? I've only ever used ym Do I need trilobyte (is that what it was called) to chat with you guys?
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On June 02 2006 08:51 FrozenArbiter wrote::o Wow. Well, I don't know how to subtitle but googling brought up http://armitage.crinkle.net/karinkuru/howtosub/ which seems well-done at a glance :o That would be really cool to have translated, but even so, it would be fun to make one. + I'm sure there are things we'd want to cover which isn't in this ;O
Yeah, I meant that you might want to look at the Gametv ones as reference. It would definitely be fun to make one.
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I have seen a bit on those movies, and it dissapointed me a bit first because I was not the first one who was to make this idea, but I still want to make that movie... I have been a bit innactive cause I have been away on a small vacation this weekend, but tomorrow I am going to start making the movie... I am really looking forward to do that =D
Still... Any more suggestions would be nice =)
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be sure to show everyone just exactly how big this is in korea
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I will... I will... =P
One thing you can be sure of, and that is that I am gonna show them how big SC/BW is in south korea =P
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gl, try to design it to convert ppl who dont play to the game :D
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The intention of my first movie is to convert ppl who dont play the game, but the next ones will be more about strategy =)
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Today I will start the project =)
Wish me luck =)
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is awesome32247 Posts
Please keep us updated (pic anything) with the work. So ill see if i can help
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I can uppload the movies to a bit torrent tracker or a file sharing server when I get something done if you want =)
I can also make some pics about this project =)
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I can't wait to see this :D! Might show this to some of my friends that don't believe it.
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Is this project still on or has everyone lost interest? I'd really like to see it. =)
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Sweden33719 Posts
I haven't seen him on msn in a long time, so I dunno :X + I've been playing so I haven't really done my part either, I'm still interested in doing it tho.
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I got the feeling he'd rather do it alone and he was never on msn anymore, so I let it go. I'm still very interested in doing this.
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I've got exams for another week or so so any help I can offer (kinda wondering if there's anything at all I can do) will be after I'm finished with them.
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